Monday 27 December 2010. Balmy evening, wind around 13 knots, beach packed with people trying to cool off after a 40 degree day. I'm down there with a visitor from Germany, swimming in the shallows. Suddenly a barechested show pony kiter on a massive white Cabhrina and surfboard comes flying past him 5 m away, trips, comes off his board, almost dropping the kite into the crowds. My friend nearly sh..t himself...

In and out the obnoxious show pony goes, always in the surf zone, cutting through the bobbing heads of swimmers, kite faltering at times, losing ground walking up the beach with an overbearing swagger, kite over the children and bikini babes, a true exciting ambassador for our sport. Well done, mate, wow, the skill level

Wonder where your crew of mates were who did the same on boxing day??

Time us kiters self policed and agreed on not kiting these popular crowded beaches unless the wind is over 20 knots and the crowds have left. The alternative is that we pretend its all good and then whine like wronged victims when the local beach user association petitions Stirling Council to ban kites at Scarbs/Brighton etc

i agree but also think its the sporting peers that inform and educate the knuckle heads when their doing something stupid (in a respectfull and freindly way).

Show pony at Brighton ignoring other punters?

I find that hard to believe.

Self policing can only do so much. Darwinism is about as relatively effective and a smack in the mush from an angry beach punter probably the most applicable to nongs like this.

Wish the shark had gobbled the fool.

James said...

I believe that we should expect the relevant authorities to deal with this kind of crap. Some people simply just don't like being told. That means if I become a self appointed policeman I may have to deal with a lot of crap when I go to deliver my 2c worth, when all I want to do really is go to my local and enjoy a sess. The type of behaviour on display at Brighton is here to stay, just like the idiots on our roads.

It's up to the authorities to deal with it and dish up fines. If they ( the authorities ) applied themselves with the same degree of zeal on the beaches as they have done in the car park at Pinna's in recent weeks,in dishing up fines for illegal parking , I feel this would go a long way in taking care of the problem, in the way it should be dealt with , is'nt that why I pay rates and taxes ?

License and registration ?, NO WAY !! It has'nt eradicated the dikheads on our roads or powered water craft, it won't stop them on kites, hit them in the pocket !

Abstention, that's they way!
Bury your head in the sand.

The guy probably thought that all the people standing on the beach looking at him were admiring his slick moves, where, in actual fact, they were all looking and commenting on how dangerous this "Knob Head" was.

How is the guy going to know, if somebody doesn't go and tell him.
He might just accept their advice and bugger off. Until you approach him you will never know.

It was said that he was walking up the beach a few times to get up wind, so perfect opportunity to (politely) let him know that he needs to be a bit more safety conscious, or even you and a lifeguard could approach him.

We have a safety policy where I work, it sort of goes that if you see something unsafe, "you own it!", and if you see somebody doing something unsafe and you do not say anything, and they have an accident, or somebody gets hurt, you are more to blame or your in-action is more culpable than the person actually doing the unsafe act, because you were aware of it and did nothing.

As far as putting you 2 bobs worth in, how are you going to feel for the next few weeks/months after you witness some kid getting his face carved up, or suffers brain damage from getting hit by a board, because you didn't say anything.

As far as not approaching a guy because of fear of aggressive behaviour, let me sort of think this through.
You approach a guy walking up the beach, trying to control a kite with one hand and has a board in the other hand. (he's probably a little out of breath from walking up wind as well)
You suggest that the area he is in or the practice is not safe to others, what's he going to do? ???
Let go the kite and board and clock you. Hardly!.
He is pretty much limited to verbal retort, or at least explain his ignorance.

And if he says something you don't like you can always clock him and run, he's still attached to the kite and board.
He's not going to come after you. And if he does he won't be kiting in amongst the crowd anymore.
You will have ruined his day, like he has ruined everybody else's.
(Don't take this as condoning violence in any way, just point out the possible out comes)

Anyway what ever happens he will be made aware of the fact that what he is doing is not appropriate, and he will also talk about it, and word will get around that it is not acceptable.

Come on buddy, go to Bunnings grab a bag of cement, and Harden TF up!
or go and get a glass of warm milk and sit in the corner and wait till somebody calls you. (but stay of the forum)

As far as letting the authorities handle it, if you want to sit back and hand over ownership and the development of the governance or regulations of kiting it in public and crowded places to a body that knows little about it, or, cares that much about what you think, or, would be happier if the policing of kiting wasn't increasing their workload, you will only have yourself to blame, at the end of the day, and you might just be the first to complain about the rules and regulations that they put in place.

Doing the right thing in public places usually gains recognition and support from others affected by bad behaviour, so if you were to approach a guy and tell him to pull his head in, and I was on the beach, and it started to get ugly, I would certainly support you (if I wasn't already telling him to "bugger off!")

Additionally it demonstrates to those not involved in the sport that there are people that kite that are responsible, and are proactive in making there sport safe. The up side for the sport is enormous to the general public and the councils etc.

I believe the Gold Coast has the right approach for discipline, confiscating boards.
That does hit the pocket and it takes them out of the game pretty quickly.
The sooner you start doing it the better, and you will hear all the idiots complaining about lost boards, and everybody will be thankful that the "knob head" was not on the water.

Anyway it's your back yard, and your problem, I just hope that you have somewhere left to kite in the next few years, when I come on holidays. Either that or I will leave my gear at home, but then if I do that I wouldn't be going there on a kiting holiday!, problem solved.... !!!!

PelicanPete said...

James said...

I believe that we should expect the relevant authorities to deal with this kind of crap. Some people simply just don't like being told. That means if I become a self appointed policeman I may have to deal with a lot of crap when I go to deliver my 2c worth, when all I want to do really is go to my local and enjoy a sess. The type of behaviour on display at Brighton is here to stay, just like the idiots on our roads.

It's up to the authorities to deal with it and dish up fines. If they ( the authorities ) applied themselves with the same degree of zeal on the beaches as they have done in the car park at Pinna's in recent weeks,in dishing up fines for illegal parking , I feel this would go a long way in taking care of the problem, in the way it should be dealt with , is'nt that why I pay rates and taxes ?

License and registration ?, NO WAY !! It has'nt eradicated the dikheads on our roads or powered water craft, it won't stop them on kites, hit them in the pocket !

Abstention, that's they way!
Bury your head in the sand.

The guy probably thought that all the people standing on the beach looking at him were admiring his slick moves, where, in actual fact, they were all looking and commenting on how dangerous this "Knob Head" was.

How is the guy going to know, if somebody doesn't go and tell him.
He might just accept their advice and bugger off. Until you approach him you will never know.

It was said that he was walking up the beach a few times to get up wind, so perfect opportunity to (politely) let him know that he needs to be a bit more safety conscious, or even you and a lifeguard could approach him.

We have a safety policy where I work, it sort of goes that if you see something unsafe, "you own it!", and if you see somebody doing something unsafe and you do not say anything, and they have an accident, or somebody gets hurt, you are more to blame or your in-action is more culpable than the person actually doing the unsafe act, because you were aware of it and did nothing.

As far as putting you 2 bobs worth in, how are you going to feel for the next few weeks/months after you witness some kid getting his face carved up, or suffers brain damage from getting hit by a board, because you didn't say anything.

As far as not approaching a guy because of fear of aggressive behaviour, let me sort of think this through.
You approach a guy walking up the beach, trying to control a kite with one hand and has a board in the other hand. (he's probably a little out of breath from walking up wind as well)
You suggest that the area he is in or the practice is not safe to others, what's he going to do? ???
Let go the kite and board and clock you. Hardly!.
He is pretty much limited to verbal retort, or at least explain his ignorance.

And if he says something you don't like you can always clock him and run, he's still attached to the kite and board.
He's not going to come after you. And if he does he won't be kiting in amongst the crowd anymore.
You will have ruined his day, like he has ruined everybody else's.
(Don't take this as condoning violence in any way, just point out the possible out comes)

Anyway what ever happens he will be made aware of the fact that what he is doing is not appropriate, and he will also talk about it, and word will get around that it is not acceptable.

Come on buddy, go to Bunnings grab a bag of cement, and Harden TF up!
or go and get a glass of warm milk and sit in the corner and wait till somebody calls you. (but stay of the forum)

As far as letting the authorities handle it, if you want to sit back and hand over ownership and the development of the governance or regulations of kiting it in public and crowded places to a body that knows little about it, or, cares that much about what you think, or, would be happier if the policing of kiting wasn't increasing their workload, you will only have yourself to blame, at the end of the day, and you might just be the first to complain about the rules and regulations that they put in place.

Doing the right thing in public places usually gains recognition and support from others affected by bad behaviour, so if you were to approach a guy and tell him to pull his head in, and I was on the beach, and it started to get ugly, I would certainly support you (if I wasn't already telling him to "bugger off!")

Additionally it demonstrates to those not involved in the sport that there are people that kite that are responsible, and are proactive in making there sport safe. The up side for the sport is enormous to the general public and the councils etc.

I believe the Gold Coast has the right approach for discipline, confiscating boards.
That does hit the pocket and it takes them out of the game pretty quickly.
The sooner you start doing it the better, and you will hear all the idiots complaining about lost boards, and everybody will be thankful that the "knob head" was not on the water.

Anyway it's your back yard, and your problem, I just hope that you have somewhere left to kite in the next few years, when I come on holidays. Either that or I will leave my gear at home, but then if I do that I wouldn't be going there on a kiting holiday!, problem solved.... !!!!

settle possum .No read to read (write) so much into it . If you introduce yourself to the lifeguards as a kiter who thinks that the dud(e) is out of line(which incidendly IS taking ownership and being responsible ) you/we as a whole get the lifeguards respect as well and they deal with it . It seems to work pretty well around here !

PelicanPete said...

James said...

I believe that we should expect the relevant authorities to deal with this kind of crap. Some people simply just don't like being told. That means if I become a self appointed policeman I may have to deal with a lot of crap when I go to deliver my 2c worth, when all I want to do really is go to my local and enjoy a sess. The type of behaviour on display at Brighton is here to stay, just like the idiots on our roads.

It's up to the authorities to deal with it and dish up fines. If they ( the authorities ) applied themselves with the same degree of zeal on the beaches as they have done in the car park at Pinna's in recent weeks,in dishing up fines for illegal parking , I feel this would go a long way in taking care of the problem, in the way it should be dealt with , is'nt that why I pay rates and taxes ?

License and registration ?, NO WAY !! It has'nt eradicated the dikheads on our roads or powered water craft, it won't stop them on kites, hit them in the pocket !

Abstention, that's they way!
Bury your head in the sand.

The guy probably thought that all the people standing on the beach looking at him were admiring his slick moves, where, in actual fact, they were all looking and commenting on how dangerous this "Knob Head" was.

How is the guy going to know, if somebody doesn't go and tell him.
He might just accept their advice and bugger off. Until you approach him you will never know.

It was said that he was walking up the beach a few times to get up wind, so perfect opportunity to (politely) let him know that he needs to be a bit more safety conscious, or even you and a lifeguard could approach him.

We have a safety policy where I work, it sort of goes that if you see something unsafe, "you own it!", and if you see somebody doing something unsafe and you do not say anything, and they have an accident, or somebody gets hurt, you are more to blame or your in-action is more culpable than the person actually doing the unsafe act, because you were aware of it and did nothing.

As far as putting you 2 bobs worth in, how are you going to feel for the next few weeks/months after you witness some kid getting his face carved up, or suffers brain damage from getting hit by a board, because you didn't say anything.

As far as not approaching a guy because of fear of aggressive behaviour, let me sort of think this through.
You approach a guy walking up the beach, trying to control a kite with one hand and has a board in the other hand. (he's probably a little out of breath from walking up wind as well)
You suggest that the area he is in or the practice is not safe to others, what's he going to do? ???
Let go the kite and board and clock you. Hardly!.
He is pretty much limited to verbal retort, or at least explain his ignorance.

And if he says something you don't like you can always clock him and run, he's still attached to the kite and board.
He's not going to come after you. And if he does he won't be kiting in amongst the crowd anymore.
You will have ruined his day, like he has ruined everybody else's.
(Don't take this as condoning violence in any way, just point out the possible out comes)

Anyway what ever happens he will be made aware of the fact that what he is doing is not appropriate, and he will also talk about it, and word will get around that it is not acceptable.

Come on buddy, go to Bunnings grab a bag of cement, and Harden TF up!
or go and get a glass of warm milk and sit in the corner and wait till somebody calls you. (but stay of the forum)

As far as letting the authorities handle it, if you want to sit back and hand over ownership and the development of the governance or regulations of kiting it in public and crowded places to a body that knows little about it, or, cares that much about what you think, or, would be happier if the policing of kiting wasn't increasing their workload, you will only have yourself to blame, at the end of the day, and you might just be the first to complain about the rules and regulations that they put in place.

Doing the right thing in public places usually gains recognition and support from others affected by bad behaviour, so if you were to approach a guy and tell him to pull his head in, and I was on the beach, and it started to get ugly, I would certainly support you (if I wasn't already telling him to "bugger off!")

Additionally it demonstrates to those not involved in the sport that there are people that kite that are responsible, and are proactive in making there sport safe. The up side for the sport is enormous to the general public and the councils etc.

I believe the Gold Coast has the right approach for discipline, confiscating boards.
That does hit the pocket and it takes them out of the game pretty quickly.
The sooner you start doing it the better, and you will hear all the idiots complaining about lost boards, and everybody will be thankful that the "knob head" was not on the water.

Anyway it's your back yard, and your problem, I just hope that you have somewhere left to kite in the next few years, when I come on holidays. Either that or I will leave my gear at home, but then if I do that I wouldn't be going there on a kiting holiday!, problem solved.... !!!!

You say that but we've learnt more often than not, that people will retaliate. Road rage is an example. Guy is sitting in traffic and yet he will go out of his way to follow you home and then beat the living crap out of you with a baseball bat.

Alternative you didn't think of - You walk up to the guy, tell the guy his behaviour isn't appropriate. He tells you to F-off. You walk away, and 5 minutes later he confronts you at your car with a baseball bat because he's that kind of person. The reality is people these days will go out of their way to beat the crap out of someone if they are disturbed enough, and if they're dumb enough to think its cool to kite through the middle of a whole lot of people, then they probably are. If they turn around and try deck a cop, they get the wrong end of a taser and/or a jail sentence.

In the old days, people would say something, but too many times these days its just not worth the risk. Have a look at the heraldsun website. Guy coming out of a nightclub randomly elbows a guy for no reason, he's now in a coma. Thats the kind of douchebags we live with these days.

kitegirl21 said...

Good post pelicanpete
I certainly feel that policing of the described idiot should not be the responsiblity of lifeguards, adding extra burden to their duties.
I think we should be presenting ourselves to the community as a proactive lot, and self policing demonstrates this.
Bo, you say the guy was walking upwind a few times, I definately would have taken it upon myself to let him know what a tool he was -in the nicest possible way- and point out all the dangers he is opening himself up to, including losing the spot for everyone because of ignorant show ponies like himself.
Most of the time people will listen to local advice and happily oblige. When they dont, thats when i'd point it out to the lifeguard.
Leaving it solely up to the lifeguards doesnt look great at council meetings. We should be doing all we can to protect our local spots to keep em open.
my 2 cents

ps. happy new year mr float! i was up ur way yesterday, didnt see ya out!

yep busy with work and lessons .I agree with what you say Holly and a friendly word with the offender is a good idea if and when the opportunity arises .I think the key up here has been to develop and excellent rapport between experienced kiters and local lifeguards .Quite a few of them are now getting into kiting also and a friendly word and regular chat ("so hows it goin Smithy , have the kiters been behavin ? ' Yeah mate Gordo (good mate of mine and ex beach co-ordinator and habitual "surf inside the flags" offender ) is the only one we have to worry about" to them is gold . Experienced kiters are not always around when the poo hits the fan or the dud(e) gets too close to the punters . The lifeguards around here now know when to step in and seriously, it doesn't take much time out of their day . It 's like when punter surfers drift inside the blue flags or is stretching their friendship ,the lifeguard knows when to step in and the incident isn't logged and there is no threat to surfing at the local break (even when it is close to the flags )

Don't panic folks I fully understand the importance of keeping local spots open but there is no need to be paranoid and there is a process that works .
My question to experienced kiters worried about their spot is 'do you know and communicate with your local lifeguards? my suggestion if you don't is get to know em and communicate with them; and you will not only have stressless summers but know that they won't let you down keeping the gits at bay when you aren't around (or are out there enjoying yourself).Seriously these guys are experienced watermen/women and understand our stoke and are not hell bent on filling out endless logs or having kitesurfing banned .they just want everyone who visits the beach to have a safe and fun time .

Self police, yes that's good.

But that 20knot idea is just ridiculous.

As much as I hate the idea of a ban,that 20knot rule makes sense, we get enough windy days in WA to sand blast any beach goers out of our way so there is absolutely no escuse for kiting in the midle of a crowd of swimmers.

Idiot at Brighton with a huge Flysurfer in the air strolling up the walkway to land on the grass (next to a clearly startled sunbather lady).

I'm fuming - but in a hurry (was conscience of kite-buddy's time limit) but another kite bloke stolls over and informs idiot it's too late for christmas turkey.

Apparently the bloke is a local (had assumed Teuro due to FS gear) and took it with decent grace.

Not a bad result. Better than me fuming and doing fk all.

BTW - good to see most crew paying attention to the flagged swimming area being a LOT further south than normal (co-incidence?) and in the spot most usually land/launch.

Still some peanuts going thru flags up n down wind didn't help, but hey you gott ride for the conditions and if that means you are underpowered then leave extra room before going around the flags.

it was a newby right?

haha funky probably best you didnt give him some of your choice words there and then, but i just had to enquire on your behalf, and for the record he was a local, a good bloke when confronted and was very much aware of the issues at hand. He said the beach was a nightmare with kites/lines/peeps everywhere (which it was) so he decided best to avoid it and hit the grass (right or wrong....we'll never quite know but at least he actually gave it some thought which is encouraged).

was good to see all kiters at brighton had moved gear 100m or so to the south of the usual path spot due to a million kids riding their christmas prezzies further up, was still one or two blokes pushing their/our luck through the crowds tho.

Keep the waves friendly, keep the run open, keep smacking lips...happy days for all

PelicanPete said...

Saffer said...

PelicanPete said...

James said...

You say that but we've learnt more often than not, that people will retaliate. Road rage is an example. Guy is sitting in traffic and yet he will go out of his way to follow you home and then beat the living crap out of you with a baseball bat.

Alternative you didn't think of - You walk up to the guy, tell the guy his behaviour isn't appropriate. He tells you to F-off. You walk away, and 5 minutes later he confronts you at your car with a baseball bat because he's that kind of person. The reality is people these days will go out of their way to beat the crap out of someone if they are disturbed enough, and if they're dumb enough to think its cool to kite through the middle of a whole lot of people, then they probably are. If they turn around and try deck a cop, they get the wrong end of a taser and/or a jail sentence.

In the old days, people would say something, but too many times these days its just not worth the risk. Have a look at the heraldsun website. Guy coming out of a nightclub randomly elbows a guy for no reason, he's now in a coma. Thats the kind of douchebags we live with these days.

Well, that pretty much ends any plans of heading to victoria for a holiday, if I do have to go, I'll stay inside and keep the blinds pulled down real low!
Which is possibly the problem as people seem to be watching too much CSI.

www.heraldsun.com.au/news/victoria/man-attacked-with-meat-cleaver/story-e6frf7kx-1225978260283

Thats where we kite

Drama queens,no need to turn this into an epic.....just tell the dude, its that simple, really!
Nobody is going to meat cleaver your head,most of theses offenders are just ignorant newbies out for a good time or egotistic show ponys with there head so far up there backside they cant see what they are doing is a danger to other beach goers,and when approached in the right manner usually say sorry mate an on there way !! Job done

Instead of a 20kt limit, how about time instead...

"No kiting before 11am". After 11am please share with kiters.

I could live with that...

Actually, better make that 10am, at least 3 days a year get windy early.

We need to figure out what to do with the retards that are ruining this sport. If we carry on the way we're going (head in the sand) and let the authorities determine our fate, we're f**ked. It's easy to pretend that things won't get worse, but they will. It's only a matter of a time before some idiot either seriously injures himself or a beach goer, then it's all over. Period. No debate. We either need to get uber pro-active and aggressive if need be and let these idiots know their behaviour isn't acceptable. What would happen if you rocked up at a local surf spot, started dropping in on people and acting like a tool? You'd lose your teeth. But you'll very quickly change your attitude. And that's what we need in kiting, an understanding that if you act like a moron there are consequences. At the moment there aren't any.