OK My two cents
For the f^&^%ing life of me i can't understand why some kiters insist on kiting in Lano main break or Dutchies break(if you can call it a break) when there is twenty plus windsurfers there Why Do they want a fight
Now i can sail south passage , mainbreak and dutchies with kites no problem when it's not crowded and don't mind them being there.But if i went to the beach and saw twenty kites on the water i would be looking for another place to sail.
It's called respect.

trevor1 said...
Chief, if its crowded its crowded ...

(Your logic applies regardless of craft)

Get over it.
[}:)]

min/avg windsurfer raduis ~ 2m/7m
min/avg kitesurfer radius ~ 20m/50m

mathew said...

trevor1 said...
Chief, if its crowded its crowded ...

(Your logic applies regardless of craft)

Get over it.
[}:)]

min/avg windsurfer raduis ~ 2m/7m
min/avg kitesurfer radius ~ 20m/50m

Divide the above by 166 to get the

min/avg windsurfer penis size
min/avg kitesurfer penis size

(Just kidding)

meerkat said...

What a load of baloney.... he did it! no HE did it! NOOOO HE DID IT! hahahaahah.

The sport isn't the problem, its the individual. Its like saying all 4x4 drivers are dangerous but people who drive 2 wheel drive cars are angels.

Yeah, I'd have to agree. You get kiters that don't know who has right of way and windsurfers that don't know who has right of way.

How do we fix that? I know I've been sailing at Safety Bay and you can tell who knows their right of way and who doesn't. The one's that don't seem to want to try and outpoint you when they should be bearing off down wind. Whether it's a kiter or a windsurfer.

I hate to say it, but maybe both groups need to do a waterways course so they know when they are supposed to give way and how to sail safely?

Mobydisc said...
Maybe swap gear too so we can see what its like on the other side of the fence. This would also work out whats harder, windsurfing or kite boarding. If after a few hours the average kite boarder can beach start a windsurfer, sail out, turn around and come back to where they started then we would congratulate them. Same for the average windsurfer doing the same with a kite.

i'd be up for that. While i agree that windsurfing IS more technical and much harder to master You aren't quite comparing a beginner kiter with a beginner windsurfer there....

I have taught both sports and if the same person was given learners equipment of each sport at the same time(hypothetically speaking obviously :) i still think the basics can be taught in a couple of hours in approx equal time for either sport.

People who are competent(or in some cases very good) at one sport(ws/ks) can grasp the basics and get going very quickly whichever way they go. Don't know how you would test it, but would be fun to try and get some guinea pig uni students to test it out while us old(er) blokes sit back and drink beer.

why dont we all try this looks like fun


www.seabreeze.com.au/forums/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=34787

That was all tongue in cheek response tp eyemhardcores silly post trevor.
All i,m saying is why kite where there is 20 plus windsurfers It can't be fun and kiters must know by now that it really pisses most windsurfers off..Just like a cupla of windsurfers sailing amongst 20 plus kiters would piss the kiters off
Do you get what i,m saying
I woudn't sail in a place that was going to piss other water users off (any water user).
RESPECT

trevor1 said...

And all I am saying sir, is that if it is crowded, it is crowded, and respect should be shown by all, no matter what you sail/fly.

THE END

Amen brother thats what i've been saying
We'll have to bump rails some day

Sorry trevor just one more point and i'm not trying to wind you up but...

As a windsurfer if i were to go windsurfing in the same area as 20 kite-boarders i am putting myself at risk.
If a kite-boarder goes kiteing in an area where there are 20 windsurfers they put everyone at risk.
In both scenarios being the minority is not fun and it pisses everyone off. So whats the point

Now i am talking more people than an area can handle.I'm not saying that i hate kites and they should be off the water, i enjoy seeing my kiteing friends in the break when theres plenty of room.

stribo said...

As a windsurfer if i were to go windsurfing in the same area as 20 kite-boarders i am putting myself at risk.
If a kite-boarder goes kiteing in an area where there are 20 windsurfers they put everyone at risk.

Nope, wrong.

* lets say spot A can handle 20 competent and safety aware poleys and 1 competent and safety aware kiter
* same spot can handle 8 competent and safety aware kiters and 1 competent and safety aware windsurfer

(ok i am just making the numbers up but you get my drift)

All water users will be able to have a safe and enjoyable time. You can't just generalise and assume that the kiter will turn up and start cutting people off, be dangerous and cause problems. The bloke might (shock horror) have a clue and follow the same tacks as the windsurfers, look over his shoulder in the blind spot(yes we have a blind spot) and not dingle dangle when there are people downwind windsurfing of him.

Its all about sharing, like that traffic circle in paris on the champs elysee, everyone shares the lanes there!! Mostly they share paint, but you know what i mean.

meerkat said...

stribo said...

As a windsurfer if i were to go windsurfing in the same area as 20 kite-boarders i am putting myself at risk.
If a kite-boarder goes kiteing in an area where there are 20 windsurfers they put everyone at risk.

Nope, wrong.

* lets say spot A can handle 20 competent and safety aware poleys and 1 competent and safety aware kiter
* same spot can handle 8 competent and safety aware kiters and 1 competent and safety aware windsurfer

(ok i am just making the numbers up but you get my drift)

All water users will be able to have a safe and enjoyable time. You can't just generalise and assume that the kiter will turn up and start cutting people off, be dangerous and cause problems. The bloke might (shock horror) have a clue and follow the same tacks as the windsurfers, look over his shoulder in the blind spot(yes we have a blind spot) and not dingle dangle when there are people downwind windsurfing of him.

Its all about sharing, like that traffic circle in paris on the champs elysee, everyone shares the lanes there!! Mostly they share paint, but you know what i mean.

I understand what your saying meerkat but conditions /wind are unpredictable.
When a windsurfer wipes out no probs everyone sails around him without loosing ground and the faller generaly hasn,t upset the entire fleet .With a kite that has fallen in the pack (and all of us wipe out) well....If the kite hasn't taken anyone out on its way down (which doesn't happen often but does happen) Then the entire fleet is in avoidance mode ..changing directions, jybing When they normaly wouldn't etc etc... blah blah blah you get what i'm saying right
I have been in this situation many times

I dunno how I missed this thread so far

Anyway, I was going to post two weeks ago about an incident at Dutchies but the day after that I had to drive to Esperance then the anger wore off etc etc....... but it is relevant to this thread.

I was sailing at Dutchies for a couple hours, SW of the groyne at the "break" and then as is my custom, on my last run I ran waaaay downwind so as to come back in north of the groyne at the "keyhole". Most Dutchies people will know where I mean: yes you can come in at a few places but only one is obviously rock free and safe.

There was a kiter going in an out and gybing (is that the word?) right in the keyhole over an over again. As I came in to the beach he had bvggered a gybe, or was adjusting something or whatever and was standing in the keyhole about 5m off the beach. I had to line him up and miss him by about 5m so I could get in. Nowhere near his lines, as he had the kite flying above his head.

Just as I stop in knee deep water, 5m from him, he abuses me (as if to say that I had all the room in the world and I could land anywhere)

My point?? (1) Like I have said here before kiters who used to windsurf or surf are tops. Those who use their brains, (unlike the above dickhead), will realise whilst they can travel in 10cm deep water, windsurfers cannot and we may sometimes have to maintain our line.
(2) I watched the above fella a while as I derigged (and fumed)..... he was not using the waves and would have been just as happy 200m north or south of where we were windsurfing. Why not go there? There was a heap of guys kiting 300m north of us. I'm happy to share it when they are tearing up waves and respecting right of way. But when the beginner to intermediates are doing the same ****e they do on the river and they do it right in the wave spots and then to add fuel to the fire they abuse me for landing where I did.... WTF????

how about this option. If you want to sail in crowded conditions, sail in crowded conditions. if you like a bit more space, utilise the other several thousand kilometres of coast line.????

Richiefish said...

how about this option. If you want to sail in crowded conditions, sail in crowded conditions. if you like a bit more space, utilise the other several thousand kilometres of coast line.????

That's the logical solution, but ---------

And some places have a special attraction, like dead flat water, or nicely breaking waves, that most of the rest of the coastline lacks.

Richiefish said...

could it be possible that most people sail/surf/kite these popular places because they feel safer sailing in company. Surely there are plenty of remote places equally good if not better that require just a bit more traveling time.(for those who feel crowded) ie scenario. ""geez it's too crowded here at bla bla bla's, lets head off to scoobie doos."

Not near Perth anyway, There are probably a few good spots N of Lano, but only accessible by 4wd. No good uncrowded spots south of Perth that I know of. (Within half a days drive anyway)