Armstrong Performance Mast Sizes

Regarding the rake, Armstrong recommend to put the mast 2 cm further back.
what's your opinion about it? mine still in the box due to a back pain.

I'd be curious why they need to be pushed back in the box because of the rake, in my mind you'd need to push them forward to compensate unless the mast bottom pushes the wing forward?

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wingedsurfer said..
Regarding the rake, Armstrong recommend to put the mast 2 cm further back.
what's your opinion about it? mine still in the box due to a back pain.

I think 2cm is a fair approximation when going shimless on an A+ fuse. I've found that using one blue shim requires about 1-1.5cm of adjustment further back and one red shim about 0.5-1cm. My go-to is one red shim with the 195 for both the 50 and 60. I've had about 15 or so sessions winging on the 935 and am super happy with the adjustment.

Yeah forgot to note: I'm riding just the 925 and 725 these days. Not sure how other foils would affect the mast adjustment.

Just had my first prone session on the 795 Mast with 925/50F/195(blueshim). Started at setting 4, then moved up to 5. Probably could have gone to 5.5 or 6. (4'5 FG board).

Waves were waist high and clean. I'm an average prone foiler...would be better if I didn't wing all the dang time haha! What I immediately noticed was the difference was more noticeable than winging with the new mast. It just feels like a completely different rig. The reduction in drag surrounding the mast just frees up everything a bunch. The V1 mast's drag created a sort of stability(drag factor) that just isn't present with the new mast, so movement in all axis feels more free, and a bit challenging with 50 fuse after first few waves, but I was getting 2-1s no problem.

I was able to basically stall out the pump on the way back out, touching down, then get it back up to speed (dealing with poor mast placement at first). On the 72 mast, as soon as I got low or slowed near stalling speed, there was no way I could get it back up and moving with the 925. It was only an hour session and the majority of time was wasted on poor mast placement, but I can tell you this mast shakes everything up and will require a bit of dialing in compared to your current setup.

I usually ride v1 around 6, so prone on the 795 will be at 5.5 next time, FYI.

Yeah it's a new and much better experience on all wings.very exciting. Can't wait to try the 1250, 1050, and the MA wings.

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kobo said..

eppo said..
Mate of mine got his first prone in - from the A plus 72 mast. I asked him what was better. He said "everything by about 200 percent. Stall speed recovery, glide, turning angle and speed, pumping especially and the resulting overall angle of attack allowable up and down the wave face. " And again that was on a numpty 1250 with that wobbly wonky V tail (can't stand it myself that tail but some love it).

Stall speed recovery is better...do you think because of change in mast angle or just more control being stiffer,I just had a session on the 1125/85/50 and I love the pump and efficiency of that wing but it can be tricky sometimes,be keen to hear from someone who prones that with the new mast.

Honestly - I'd say it's the drastic lack of drag, at all heights on the mast. Of course the rake must help . even board at horizontal plane your angle of attack isn't at critical angle. Probably even slightly inclined if you over do the lift a bit. Combination of factors. Stiffness of course is a bu product of the design profile and carbon lay up as well - helps with directing power efficiently through the mast. Combo of rake, design and it's resulting stiffness. Which feels like a lower stall speed . it's probably not.

I mean hey we are talking about high modulus masts now - gonfoil have been doing them since 2016 bahabababbaba

Ah it's all beyond my understanding. It just works. I can't confirm it on HA wings though haven't used one on this new mast.

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paulweller2 said..

MidAtlanticFoil said..
Just had my first prone session on the 795 Mast with 925/50F/195(blueshim). Started at setting 4, then moved up to 5. Probably could have gone to 5.5 or 6. (4'5 FG board).

Waves were waist high and clean. I'm an average prone foiler...would be better if I didn't wing all the dang time haha! What I immediately noticed was the difference was more noticeable than winging with the new mast. It just feels like a completely different rig. The reduction in drag surrounding the mast just frees up everything a bunch. The V1 mast's drag created a sort of stability(drag factor) that just isn't present with the new mast, so movement in all axis feels more free, and a bit challenging with 50 fuse after first few waves, but I was getting 2-1s no problem.

I was able to basically stall out the pump on the way back out, touching down, then get it back up to speed (dealing with poor mast placement at first). On the 72 mast, as soon as I got low or slowed near stalling speed, there was no way I could get it back up and moving with the 925. It was only an hour session and the majority of time was wasted on poor mast placement, but I can tell you this mast shakes everything up and will require a bit of dialing in compared to your current setup.

I usually ride v1 around 6, so prone on the 795 will be at 5.5 next time, FYI.

MAF: slightly off topic but wondering why you opt for the blue shim with that setup. I have the same setup (but with the 935). Thanks!

I typically like a bit of lift from the tail to give some opposing feedback to the front wing, which adds drag, but keeps it a bit more stable at speed. I change it up a bunch, and my buddy just told me he was riding his with two red shims prone, so it's kinda guessing for me at this point with the new mast.

Just had a wing session in flat water to try and push the HA726/935 Mast a bit. Started with blue shim, 60 fuse and mast at 5.5 on the 60L. Could have moved forward a bit (mental note). Hit a personal best of 22.4mph pretty easily with my 5M OR Glide. Then I went and took out the blue shim and my max speed dropped to 20.4 on the same stretch. The drag on my arms was noticeably increased as well, but the stability was also increased. I went in and added two red shims and moved mast way forward, but the wind died - curious how that reduction in drag would have felt. Again this mast is accentuating changes to the rig as there is less 'noise' coming from the mast. Pretty mind blowing.

How you guys finding the "stability" of these Ha wings with the new mast ? Improved. ? You know what I mean - is their less unpredictable weirdness. ?

Crazy out of control session today. 25-30kts plus chest high chop in between 8-10 foot swells. The extra mast length definitely saved me a few times. Also, no cavitation which would have typically happened 2-3 times on a day like this. Was riding the 525.

To North Kites point way back, there is some adjustment/learning for me to recalibrate how I turn on a wave. I feel like the longer mast puts more pressure on my ankles.

So far, the best session I've had on the 935 was in lighter winds but that's not about the mast, it was just really challenging today.

Ill say this, it recovered from a mild breach really well and the glide on the 525 is exponentially better.

More later, another couple of big wind big wave days ahead.

I was able to test that two red shim set-up I mentioned above, but my gps paused by mistake. Overall the +1 tail Setting with 195 tail and 725 felt fantastic in relatively flat water (15 cm bumps occasionally). Mast moved up to 7.5 on 60L. It just felt extremely fluid and friction free, like more than any other set-up I've tried. I was doing S-Turns going past 12 o'clock and going very slow and maintained lift. Wingtips out with the 935 mast on the way into the turn. Transitions were a bit more technical, so keep that in mind. Can't wait to try this set-up on clean bumps/waves.

Speed runs I'm guessing were close to the 22.4 mph and it did feel a little bit rear footed at speed, so maybe even more forward positioning may be worth testing. Less droppy/jumpy feeling than I remember when riding with the 85cm mast. Will have to test in more agitated water to confirm this though.

Side note- Wingman chest harness is legit in the cold with gloves.

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Windoc said..

MidAtlanticFoil said..
Transitions were a bit more technical, so keep that in mind.

More technical in which way? Less stable due to +1 set up? Any of you on the 935 still wishing it was an 85cm or that you'd gone to a 795 for winging? A few of us locally have ordered the new masts (2 x 935cm and 1 x 795) and should have them soon. All of us have been very torn on the sizing.

I'm not sure, but I was having only like a 50% make rate on my toeside tacks, which are normally like 90%. Partially could have been being overpowered on my 5M - felt a lot of resistance on the wing leading edge when depowered into the tack (20 knts). Gybes were not really a problem for me - although rapid speed gain lol. I think the thought to take into transitions when this type of reactive/quick setup is to really just set your rail and let it come around. I usually botch it when I'm adjusting height and arc too much. The ones that feel good are just set - hold - and repowered the other direction. With less shim in the tail, it is generally easier to hold that good line through a transition due to the added pitch stability/traction from the tail.

Regarding mast size, I'm pretty stoked winging the 935. If I wasn't also a prone foiler and didn't deal with lower tides, I would have skipped on the 795. That being said, if I had to pick one mast to cover prone and wing, the 795 is perfect. I wouldn't be surprised if the 85 performance size comes out later, but for me - I'm happy with these two sizes. Replacing my 100-85-72 with 93.5-79.5 is perfecto. The 795 will be great for DW runs i bet too if I ever get into DW Sup/Prone. Winging you can go either way on DW runs.

I will add that the +1 shim setup (2 reds) with 935 mast moved forward made the setup feel more reactive and similar to the 795 size.

First, a PSA for those who are just getting their masts... my initial attempt to get the fuselage aligned involved a rubber mallet, more than 30 minutes, and some colorful words only to have it still not quite aligned with the holes. Figuring I must be doing something wrong, I found the video below and it works exactly as he describes it, it's weird. The amount of force required is about the same as throwing a dart.

Great feedback cheers. As for the fuse vid above that's how I did mine and also how I always get my fuse off. It ain't that hard.