PTWoody said...

62mac said...


PT, Not sure where your going from saying south of Tweed Heads.Is it sour grapes for some reason

No, why would there be sour grapes? The OP asked why I don't buy local boards. I explained it's because these elusive boards are never to be seen where I live. I was going to say south of the Murray but figured I may as well rope in NSW too. My simple point is this - when I think of buying local, that to me, means in my area, driving distance, someone I can talk to face-to-face. Local is not on the end of a phone a thousand miles away. I'm not having a go at these guys in QLD. Just giving you the reason why I have bought 10 SUPs in the last 18 months and none of them have been "local".

There are two takes on local,one which you explained well and the bigger picture in this small industry of sup,I call local, Australian made.In the word elusive you mean hard to get your hands on at a guess.Just call it frustration then
PT the sport will grow and we will have many local options but I for one will be sitting on a porch in a rocking chair by that time.

so, the Doctor raises some interesting points...

As far as an import tariff goes, you seem to think this will benefit the citizens of this country, when in reality it will only benefit the small industry it is designed to artificially protect. Consider the US sugar tariff, where sugar can be bought across the globe for 4c a pound, yet the US maintains a tariff to ensure if doesn't drop below 25c a pound. This protects the local industry but pushes higher than required prices onto the consumer, who do you think pays the extra? Then on top of that you create a booming grey market with items sold via ebay and the like directly imported out of Hong Kong, then nobody benefits as both the local manufacturer and retailer are cut out. Sorry but free trade is the only way to go with this sort of item in this day and age.

Also, I have run comps in the past for different sports, and yes while the big names do see this as a form of advertising and marketing, without their financial contribution there would be no prizes, no trophies, no t-shirts at sign on, no beers at the end of the day, no insurance and none of the other items that have to be bought by the organisers in the weeks and months before the event starts. Yes the entrance fees might partly cover these costs but the reality is they need to paid usually well before the entrance fees are collected.

Ok, to keep Lacey happy....

As a long time Windsurfer I am comfortable buying pop-outs. The east coast hasn't had a reputable custom board builder in this space for a number of years. Given that I am buying from brands I know and trust through the windsurf relationship I am usually always comfortable that my new board will be well constructed, and a good design - even if it may be 6 to 12 months old by virtue of being a pop out. and I can be comfortable that demo I rode is exactly the same as the new board I just picked up.

That all being said I am just now starting to get a feel for what I might want in a SUP and may well look at a custom for my next board.

Oh, and to the outsider, your own ability to go through customs on what seems to be a weekly basis isn't the greatest advertisement. Now I realise that is part of your desire to be involved in development, but one might question why it takes so many boards to get the one that is right? and is this an issue with going for the local custom built model? just an observation.

aus301 said...

so, the Doctor raises some interesting points...

As far as an import tariff goes, you seem to think this will benefit the citizens of this country, when in reality it will only benefit the small industry it is designed to artificially protect. Consider the US sugar tariff, where sugar can be bought across the globe for 4c a pound, yet the US maintains a tariff to ensure if doesn't drop below 25c a pound. This protects the local industry but pushes higher than required prices onto the consumer, as who do you think pays the extra? Then on top of that you create a booming grey market with item sold via ebay and the like directly imported out of Hong Kong, then nobody benefits as both the local manufacturer and retailer are cut out. Sorry but free trade is the only way to go with this sort of item in this day and age.

Also, I have run comps in the past for different sports, and yes while the big names do see this as a form of advertising without their financial contribution there would be no prizes, no trophies, no t-shirts at sign on, no beers at the end of the day, no insurance and none of the other items that have to be bought by the organisers in the weeks and months before the events starts. Yes the entrance fees might partly cover these costs the reality is they need to paid usually well before the entrance fees are collected.

Ok, to keep Lacey happy....

As a long time Windsurfer I am comfortable buying pop-outs. The east coast hasn't had a reputable customer board builder in this space for a number of years. Given that I am buying from brands I know and trust through the windsurf relationship I am usually always comfortable that my new board is well constructed, and a good design - even if it may be 6 to 12 months old by virtue of being a pop out. and I can be comfortable that demo I rode is exactly the same as the new board I just picked up.

That all being said I am just now starting to get a feel for what I might want in a SUP and may well look at a custom for my next board.

Oh, and to the outsider your own ability to go through customs on what seems to be a weekly basis isn't the greatest advertisement. Now I realise that is part of your desire to be involved in development, but one might question why it takes so many boards to get the one that is right? and is this an issue with going for the local custom built model? just an observation.

Just on your last comment on Lacey's development.I've had three customs made in the past four months all the same model just looking for that perfect performer.
Oh its fun btw,you feel a real sense of ownership as well

aus301 said...

so, the Doctor raises some interesting points...

As far as an import tariff goes, you seem to think this will benefit the citizens of this country, when in reality it will only benefit the small industry it is designed to artificially protect. Consider the US sugar tariff, where sugar can be bought across the globe for 4c a pound, yet the US maintains a tariff to ensure if doesn't drop below 25c a pound. This protects the local industry but pushes higher than required prices onto the consumer, as who do you think pays the extra? Then on top of that you create a booming grey market with item sold via ebay and the like directly imported out of Hong Kong, then nobody benefits as both the local manufacturer and retailer are cut out. Sorry but free trade is the only way to go with this sort of item in this day and age.

Also, I have run comps in the past for different sports, and yes while the big names do see this as a form of advertising without their financial contribution there would be no prizes, no trophies, no t-shirts at sign on, no beers at the end of the day, no insurance and none of the other items that have to be bought by the organisers in the weeks and months before the events starts. Yes the entrance fees might partly cover these costs the reality is they need to paid usually well before the entrance fees are collected.

Ok, to keep Lacey happy....

As a long time Windsurfer I am comfortable buying pop-outs. The east coast hasn't had a reputable customer board builder in this space for a number of years. Given that I am buying from brands I know and trust through the windsurf relationship I am usually always comfortable that my new board is well constructed, and a good design - even if it may be 6 to 12 months old by virtue of being a pop out. and I can be comfortable that demo I rode is exactly the same as the new board I just picked up.

That all being said I am just now starting to get a feel for what I might want in a SUP and may well look at a custom for my next board.

Oh, and to the outsider your own ability to go through customs on what seems to be a weekly basis isn't the greatest advertisement. Now I realise that is part of your desire to be involved in development, but one might question why it takes so many boards to get the one that is right? and is this an issue with going for the local custom built model? just an observation.

hi, for starters, you are looking at the person who posted, not the question.

it's not about the boards not being right. no board is perfect- there's aways room for improvement. are you still using the same 10 year old pop out that was suppose the bees knees. don't the pop outs re new just about every year and they tell you they are the best

people have said they like to see what i'm up to with trying designs and ideas. these design quite often don't make the standard dc models.

you are getting confused with what i do and what are actually standard dc boards.
i'll just keep my ideas to myself i think to save trouble and grief -geez

do you think pop outs nail their r and d ideas every time?

the new board i have is a standard model. you are welcomed to try it
cheers

WOW! Back in my shortboard days, I was living in Mandurah WA (mal heaven). I wasn't beating them so I decided to join them. I went to my local shaper who had made me a shortboard I loved. He said, "Go buy a chinese board from the surfshop, they're pretty good and they are cheap as."

aus301 said...

laceys lane said...

hi, for starters, you are looking at the person who posted, not the question.

Not at all, you asked why not Australian? My answer is that given that some people seem to go through 10 customs to my one pop out in their quest to get the perfect board that may not be the best advertisement to go down the custom route. Nothing to do with the person, as we have never met I have no reason to post anything based on you as a person, only an observation.

Now I am on no way knocking that process or anyone who gets to play in space, if that is what you like more power to you. And if I had the finances to enable me to work with a shaper and develop a perfect board for me through a progression of a number of shapes I would probably be there with you. But unfortunately I don't.

As for standard DC models, I didn't even know they had std models. We only see what we do through the forum and they always seem to be custom models. That lack of information about what is happening in the local custom space could well be another issue as to why not Australian.

i,m sorry. i just get a bit worked up sometimes. i put a lot of thought and money into trying stuff that may or may not work and to have some people write that process off as in your a dill is hard too take. maybe i should be a bit clearer about what i'm doing and whats the standard board.

you are probably right about not enought info by the local shapers. most do have standard shapes- they are the ones that work.
to be honest, unless you paddle a real lot, most of these tinkerings you wouldn't be able to tell, but they do add up to better boards in the future. just look at the logs we were all on two years ago and now
cheers

Geezas talk about a can of worms,I bet those prone guys are laughing their tits off at this lot,**** me is life so serious.

doggie said...

Hey Lacey I bet you get boards from DC at a good price as you have ordered alot from him. If I, as an off the street punter how much would he sell me a board for?
Firstly I have no idea what they are worth and just interested to know what is a baseline.

Btw unless you feel comfortable don't say what you paid, not a good idea generally

Tbc when I have a figure


Peace

i'm a bit cheaper the retail i guess. to be honest i don't even know what the retail is.

i don't argue a price, i just ask how much and pay it. i trust the man. then again, same as jacko or scotty. when i get my surfboards through base or coolie surf or whatever it is now, i just ask damo how much.

if i think they have done the wrong think- it's see you later
cheers

Interesting topic , and no easy answer.I dont think guys who shape boards got in to it to make a million bucks.And if they find it hard to compete against imports , well they just have to raise the bar , and make their product more appealing.Its not all about price !Its more about confidence in the product you are buying and many many many people buy on emotion rather than their brain.Ie how the product or person selling the product makes them feel.Local manufacturers all ways pull out the buy me caus im Aussie card its hard to compete ect ect. Well they have to have an offering that is more attarctive than pop outs.Here is a silly idea if i was a local shaper i would be offering a free ding repair service for my boards , a good warranty against manufacturing faults , a free surf lesson for novices a discount for future board purchases or discounts for friends and family , ect ect ect.People will pay more for good products and service.

Rant over

OK,I have a bad rep in here and thats ok with me,as my profile says, say it as it is!!!

Remember the word I said a longtime ago that gave me so much grief.

Pioneer haha Lacey sorry all Pioneers get shot,its a fact of life.

I sent you a PM but your inbox is on overload JK

Sorry boys I'm at my limit for posts on this topic so I'll just leave with this.....
What are you guys doing on Friday? Because I'll be in Hawaii!!!!!!

Oh and by the way, you can't touch this.

I like the doctor's proses even if I dont agree with them generally, they're good value and make you think a bit.

so as for managing stock, I don't agree. How managing a product that changes every week compare to one that changes once a year would be the same is beyond my understanding considering the surf shops we have in this country. Not to mention the resale value of the boards that is gold one week and worth peanuts the week after... I dont consider boards as consumables.

I also smile when we were told we would be third world servants to the big asian countries. Well, when these countries finish or shall I say slow their growth and stop depending on our mining resources, money will have to flow from somewhere else big style and we'll be pleased to rely on tourism.

So Lacey to answer your question.
I bought local, I wanted to do the "right thing". That's where the good bit stops.
Often small business are made of passionate people that love their discipline but haven't got a clue about business, customer service and marketing. Now I'm left with a board (not custom I precise) that has lost more than 55% of its value in not even 7 months. Well if anyone thinks that's acceptable for a racing sup, I don't, not in such a short period anyway. So my next board will be an import because the service will be there this time. If I had a good experience in the first place I'd very likely say different I admit but the truth is in the facts sadly.
On the other hand if you want a custom then it makes sense to go local. A custom board is not a transaction based on money but on emotion in my eyes so it's often an experience that will cost in the end when it comes to re-sale the board.

On the other hand if you want a custom then it makes sense to go local. A custom board is not a transaction based on money but on emotion in my eyes so it's often an experience that will cost in the end when it comes to re-sale the board.

A custom board is generally one (for me ) based on what i want from my board, whether it is flat rocker thin rails quad /da da da da da and to communicate/share with your board maker v what can be purchased from an import line at the time,

Crikeys no right or rong answer It is what ever blows your hair back at the time IMO

For me information is king. I love it when the industry people get on here and talk about their products. Usually there happy to give info on products that they don't even sell.
The only custom sup I have bought (out of about 10-12) was from Rod Hocker. He used to get on here and give his opinion and you got a sense of where he was heading and why, in both design and production. Then you could decide if you were happy with that. I've bought boards from Jacko and Ang because I get an idea of how they compare to other boards from reviews and comparisons they do. Same with Scotty from Greenline and Courts with JL.
Dale once told me he diidn't think it was right for him to get on here and talk about his boards but I bet his orders would go up if he did. I don't look at it as pimping, it's information and I can choose to take it on board or not. I can ask questions and get answers without having to make an appointment.
If I bought another custom, it would probably be from DTM because he posts on here, gives his opinion and backs them with reasons.
Personally, I don't care if a board is local or not, i'm just looking for the right board for me at the time.

Thought provoking post.
During the 80's the vast majority of surfboards available were locally made by surfers we saw in the water. You bought what they were experimenting with.

There were very few alternatives coming from overseas. The culture has revolved around being part of the crew.
In surfing that culture is still there to some degree but the overseas stuff is obviously making in-roads.
I only buy customs or locally made because I know what works for me.

Started SUPs and had no idea what does what. Just wanted a cheap board to paddle on flat water. The cheap Chinese imports were half the cost of all others. Moved on to 2nd hand expensive imports because thats whats around.
Next bought new expensive import because was able test demos without initial outlay fears. Don't know of any local shapers in my area.

Must admit the local v overseas question didn't enter my mind with the SUPs, just did what suited to progress into the sport. I'll think more about local stuff once I understand what works for me.