Why is the equimpment more dangerous? has it got razor blades on it or something? come on really most of the boards are smaller than most mals..

paul.j said...

Why is the equimpment more dangerous? has it got razor blades on it or something? come on really most of the boards are smaller than most mals..

Well, it's my understanding that they have much greater volume than mals, so they're more likely to be "caught" by the whitewater and drag the rider along and/or bounce and pop out in random directions. Also greater weight. Also a paddle. And from some clips I've seen lots of guys are more concerned about holding their paddle than controlling their board. I've read lots of posts on here about guys snapping leggies, so there must be a reason for that happening (I don't know about mals but I don't think it happens as much with them - ?). I put that down to weight and volume?

When I wipe out on a shortboard, if there's anyone around I do my absolute best to keep the board as close to me as possible. If I do lose control with people around I'm usually mortified and apologise if my board so much as headed towards others out of control. IMHO I shouldn't put myself or them in a position where there's a chance I could've hit them. If there is a chance then maybe I should'nt be riding outside them.

Legion said...

paul.j said...

Why is the equimpment more dangerous? has it got razor blades on it or something? come on really most of the boards are smaller than most mals..

Well, it's my understanding that they have much greater volume than mals, so they're more likely to be "caught" by the whitewater and drag the rider along and/or bounce and pop out in random directions. Also greater weight. Also a paddle. And from some clips I've seen lots of guys are more concerned about holding their paddle than controlling their board. I've read lots of posts on here about guys snapping leggies, so there must be a reason for that happening (I don't know about mals but I don't think it happens as much with them - ?). I put that down to weight and volume?

When I wipe out on a shortboard, if there's anyone around I do my absolute best to keep the board as close to me as possible. If I do lose control with people around I'm usually mortified and apologise if my board so much as headed towards others out of control. IMHO I shouldn't put myself or them in a position where there's a chance I could've hit them. If there is a chance then maybe I should'nt be riding outside them.

Sorry don't take this the wrong way but TOSSER comes to mind. Just go surfing mate.

loco4olas said...

paul.j said...


Closest to the peak of the wave when broken has the right, so if i sit way out the back and get on the swell first and cut to where the wave will break first its mine but if some one sits on the peak deeper than me its all his, seems easy to me.

Jacko

So if I'm on a short board and closest to the peak and 10m or so inside (towards the beach etc.) from the SUP, I have right of way? Or if the SUP is able to get inside me (closer to the peak) from his 10m further out position, is the wave now his (or hers)?

This is my reason for this topic. This is what I'm curious about. Currently it seems that the SUP has right of way. I mean I'd probably let them take the wave in either situation. But what if he takes every set this way? He's got a paddle advantage to catch the wave, and an advantage to paddle back out in 1/4 the time it takes me. And then what if a few of his mates paddle out?

The way it used to be (pre-SUP), if you wanted the most waves you needed to put in time and effort to entitle yourself. That advantage is now gone. Do you beat them or join them?

Also, like doggie implies, I'm not even going to put myself in a position to catch waves near a SUP. The (lack of) manoeverability and danger precludes me being anywhere near them. Too scary, consequences too high. I know how close I can get to a kook on a shortboard. Avoiding a kook on a SUP puts me way out of where I want to be (out of the way but close to the critical areas - take-off zone, shoulder, etc).

Good surfers get more waves via a better understanding of the ocean! Greedy people use their ability, fitness, bad manners or equipment to take more than their share, simple.

Stupid careless people endanger others with their actions, as Jacko said surfing is meant to be fun, riding in an ambo to the emergency ward after some kook speared you, ran you over (couldnt even turn?) or let go of his board and hit you in the head can take the shine off somewhat. I fear like a lot of people that some people on SUP have no idea and are putting others at risk. Even a small HP sup is generally bigger and much harder to control than a Mal, possibly not in length, definitely in volume. The stupid careless gumboot is usually on a 12'er though.

Take a greedy, stupid person and there is the person giving everyone a bad name.

I hate being dropped in on, even by mates, especially when it's hollow. You can't use the whole wave and sometimes things just go wrong. I got smashed in the shin 4 years ago (by another shortboarder, this problem exists universally) and put me out of the water after ulceration of the wound for 2 1/2 months. This by a wayward board after being dropped in on. I got off easy.

Legion said...

This is my reason for this topic. This is what I'm curious about. Currently it seems that the SUP has right of way. I mean I'd probably let them take the wave in either situation. But what if he takes every set this way? He's got a paddle advantage to catch the wave, and an advantage to paddle back out in 1/4 the time it takes me. And then what if a few of his mates paddle out?

The way it used to be (pre-SUP), if you wanted the most waves you needed to put in time and effort to entitle yourself. That advantage is now gone. Do you beat them or join them?

Also, like doggie implies, I'm not even going to put myself in a position to catch waves near a SUP. The (lack of) manoeverability and danger precludes me being anywhere near them. Too scary, consequences too high. I know how close I can get to a kook on a shortboard. Avoiding a kook on a SUP puts me way out of where I want to be (out of the way but close to the critical areas - take-off zone, shoulder, etc).

I think part of the reason for the topic is that you and your 'mate' doggie are what is known as internet 'trolls'.

I mean really..... goatboats did it for years, then mals (still doing it) and now SUPs.

What do you want to hear....I say join em mate. I got the sh!ts with crowded surf and the general amount of tools found at any given spot in Sydney so got a SUP. I get 5 times as many waves am twice as fit and best of all have heaps more fun.

Personally I try and avoid crowds (cause you can on a SUP) or keep a low profile, and you still get tons of waves.

goatman said...

I think part of the reason for the topic is that you and your 'mate' doggie are what is known as internet 'trolls'.

No, I'm not trolling. I've been scared of SUP for a couple of years now and so I lurk on these forums a fair bit to try to find out what you think.

goatman said...

I mean really..... goatboats did it for years, then mals (still doing it) and now SUPs.

I rarely come across goatboats (moreso in the 80s and 90s) and don't really surf with mals much. Seems SUPs are more widespread than either.

goatman said...

What do you want to hear....I say join em mate. I got the sh!ts with crowded surf and the general amount of tools found at any given spot in Sydney so got a SUP. I get 5 times as many waves am twice as fit and best of all have heaps more fun.

Nah, won't happen. I like to do turns and manoeuvres, and it seems that the majority of vids and pictures of turns on SUPs they rely heavily on their paddle to turn. I especially like barrels, and it seems they're particularly difficult on a SUP. It's not for me (in the foreseeable future).

doggie said...

Legion said...

paul.j said...

Legion said...

paul.j said...

Why is the equimpment more dangerous? has it got razor blades on it or something? come on really most of the boards are smaller than most mals..

Well, it's my understanding that they have much greater volume than mals, so they're more likely to be "caught" by the whitewater and drag the rider along and/or bounce and pop out in random directions. Also greater weight. Also a paddle. And from some clips I've seen lots of guys are more concerned about holding their paddle than controlling their board. I've read lots of posts on here about guys snapping leggies, so there must be a reason for that happening (I don't know about mals but I don't think it happens as much with them - ?). I put that down to weight and volume?

When I wipe out on a shortboard, if there's anyone around I do my absolute best to keep the board as close to me as possible. If I do lose control with people around I'm usually mortified and apologise if my board so much as headed towards others out of control. IMHO I shouldn't put myself or them in a position where there's a chance I could've hit them. If there is a chance then maybe I should'nt be riding outside them.

Sorry don't take this the wrong way but TOSSER comes to mind. Just go surfing mate.

Why am I a tosser? Can you elaborate? I opened this topic out of curiousity and I'm trying to be polite and put forward my thoughts and opinions. I wanted to know how the SUP guys think. I didn't find your comment particularly helpful.

To elaborate on my quoted post, it's a matter of pride that I've got a reasonable ability from years of effort. Because of that, I don't want to spoil others' experience in the water and I'd like others not to spoil mine. I don't want to scare or endanger others and if I do, I shouldn't be out there.

Mmmm a site spono calling someone a tosser, not a good move in my books.

Why? i say it like it is.
As gootie said you guys are just trolling and because i sit here with a broken leg and nothing better to do i bite a bit.At the moment i'm not sponoing this site it just has that on my profile but even if i was i would still say it like it is its just who i am. If you are looking for some one to say yes you are right and SUP's should just go away then you've come to the wrong place. Yes there are noobs on SUP's we all know that and i can tell you that there are 100's more coming and pretty much nothing you can do about it. Yes in a perfect world no one would drop in and there would be plenty of waves for all but its not like that in the real world and as much as i dont like it it is dog eat dog at some places, funny thing is i know that before i paddle out so it's of no surprise to me when some one drops in. I never drop in on guys unless they are mates or they have faded me first then what's good for one is good for all.

Maybe if you guys tried it then you would see the point.

Old mates a TOSSER why, like i said to loco you seem like a smart guy so think about it.

Clown
[}:)] evil
cool
Like i said, i'll say it like i see it, i wont hide behide some user name. If you want some one to blow smoke up your arse then there are plenty of people who might ablidge but i'm not one of them.

paul.j said...

As gootie said you guys are just trolling ...

No, I'm not trolling. Unless by trolling you mean "starting a topic on a forum with a dissenting view".

paul.j said...

If you are looking for some one to say yes you are right and SUP's should just go away then you've come to the wrong place.

Much as I wish they'd never become popular, no, I didn't expect this at all. I wanted some insight and I've got some.

paul.j said...

Yes there are noobs on SUP's we all know that and i can tell you that there are 100's more coming and pretty much nothing you can do about it.

This is what scares me about SUP.

paul.j said...

Remember this that is what surfing is about, seriously who cares if someone drops in. i'm sure there are bigger things to worry about in life. Go and hang out in the hospital and see whats important and what's not. I say just be happy you can be out there at all!!!

Jacko

Absolutely agree with this. I work on a hospital campus and every day see all sorts of people far worse off than me, I am just thankful I can get out there at all.

goatman said...

You would be majorly surprised if you got to surf with someone on a small lightweight SUP what can be done on em. You can actually take off deepr imo, on a gnarly reef break, and they ride barrels fine.

Maybe. I thought I read a thread on here about barrels and how difficult they are and how a lot of people's ultimate goal was to get a barrel on a SUP? At any rate, I'd be surprised if it was easy what with a paddle and a high volume board, generally longer board.

goatman said...

The paddle turning comment is total BS, ya turn em by sinking a rail and pushing with ya back foot, the paddle just gives a bit more leverage.

Some of the positions these guys are in seem almost impossible without a paddle. In a lot of the pictures the paddle is quite loaded up. Some of them really don't look like they're turning off the rail. All of them look (to my untrained eye) like the paddle plays a significant role.

Whoa-Legion has ammo....

loco4olas said...

Whoa-Legion has ammo....

That's just from the last few pages of the SUP gallery, dunno who they all are. I've gotta admit, the "layback" cutback doesn't really appeal to me. It seems a big move in SUP but it very obviously relies on the paddle. I'd rather see the rider hold the paddle in one hand and do a proper body torque cutback. I don't know if that's feasible or even "stylish" in SUP circles. Just my personal taste.

And some of those off-the-lip moves look good, but looking closely the paddle is either loaded right up (visible bent shaft) or pushing a lot of water. So to me that says the rider is leaning on it. Again, not for me, although it mightn't be a problem to you guys and indeed is probably an integral part of the whole riding experience.

Legion said...

loco4olas said...

And, I think Legion is asking pertinent questions in a polite, respectful and reasonable manner.

Thanks loco4olas. But you're only saying that because you "know" me from another forum, right?

I put forward all my SUP fears on another forum a few weeks ago, similar to this thread. The surfers there obviously had similar views to me.

I'm trying to be respectful so I don't know how I can be labelled a troll. I could've come on here swearing and ridiculing (probably be banned on this forum) but I'm genuinely interested (and terrified) in/of the SUP mentality.

OK, you just lost me. SUP Mentality???

In my garage and under my house are boards I ride regularly excluding keepers and collectables there is a 6'0 Twin, 6'2, 6'3, 6'5, 6'8, 7'0 Tri's. 11' prone paddleboard, 9'3 SUP, 17' SUP, 3 skateboards, OC paddles plus other toys. Most of them get used multiple times each week.

How can you generalise with a comment like SUP Mentality???. A good proportion of people on SUP still ride shortboards amongst other surf craft daily. I don't know your background but I would also say many of them also ride a shortboard as well or better than yourself. Instead of hating life in unfavourable conditions for a shorty many of us have expanded our fun time on the ocean. Is that a bad thing???

Not everyone is a danger or a hog, this can not be made any clearer.

Closest to the curl has the right of way. If a SUP takes off on an unbroken section and cuts back towards the section that is GOING to break but in doing so, crosses the path of prone paddlers, it's really a grey area. Whilst its not probably the best of form, theoretically they still have the right of way.
Rules about dropping in have been around for ages. Don't see any need to alter them simply someone came with an idea of how to get into the wave earlier. It will all work itself out in the fullness of time.
Is this all about dropping in or is it more about the fact there is 100% more aggro and 100% less tolerance in the water these days.

BTW, thanks to the experienced pronie that dropped in twice on Sunday and rode his board laying down beside me, whilst grinning from ear to ear and to the hoots of his pronie mates. A lesser person would have put three slice marks over his back as they went up and smacked the lip, but then again, I paddled even further down to the suckier section and surfed that instead.

And ther moral of the story is "See anyone can be a dangerous fool if they try hard enough"

(Oi Jacko, are you suffering from salt water withdrawl symptoms?)