hmm...i'm not sure, but I would expect your weight only matters in relation to the size of the gear you take out.

i kind of reason if you had two clones of identical skill and style , Alice & Bruno. Alice weighs 75% of Bruno (and is 75% of his height). When Bruno is out sailing, if Alice has the same kit, but 25% smaller (25% less litre-age, 25% less sail size etc) I think they'd both feel overpowered and underpowered at the same time.

caveat; this is a theory, and not based on anything but a hunch. i could be way off on this one. and if you're going to clone, please get a responsible adult to supervise.

Long time no see Gestalt..
I only have one mast..a sailworks lipstick 430cm 55% carbon..(?)..and have sailworks revos,3.3 , 4.2 , 5m, 6.2m retro sailworks..& KA concept 6.6m..

Al Planet said...

To look at Dinki or Elbo you would think that being huge is a big bonus but most of the wavesailors are smaller eg. Morenos, Mike Waltz, so I think it's just having the right gear and TOW. In high winds this equals high carbon 370 - 400 masts.

Why such short masts..softer..?

aus301 said...

Technique, technique, technique.

With good technique you will get going earlier on any given size sail and hold it for longer.

+ I suspect muscle & fitness..hence blokes that get out everyday can handle a wider range..

aus301 said...

Technique, technique, technique.

With good technique you will get going earlier on any given size sail and hold it for longer.

Agreed - it is not what you have (not) got it is how you use it!

Bugger.. more $..[}:)]

I agree with mast size and stiffness, lighter sailors are better on softer masts.
Of course there's always how you rig the sail.
Too flat will limit the bottom end, too baggy without enough twist will limit the top end.

I've found a few uncamned big sails that just don't work with my 70kg no matter how I set them.
They are too flat at low wind speeds, even with -ve outhaul and the centre of effort is forward. As the wind picks up the sail starts to fill out and get power and shape, but the centre of effort moves back. So the sail hasn no bottom end and is very unstable over the wind range I want to use it in. For somebody over 90kg, this isn't a problem, as they are using it in a higher wind range, where the sail has reached it's full shape.

I think a lot of sail testers are heavy guys, they're fine with sails that need a bit of force to take shape.
But if you're light, you need sails that turn on early!
In other words when they're rigged on the beach, you should be able to put a little bit of weight on the window around the harness lines and the sail should fill out fully. the luff sleave should be tight around the boom. If there is any loose sail the shape will move backwards as the wind increases, giving poor bottom end and unstable top end.

This could be a greater cause of your problem than the mast, I'm not familiar with your sails.

KenHo said...

Yes, OTOH, masts will last for a decade or more, even with lots of use.
My last 430 lasted 13 years.

sboardcrazy said...

Bugger.. more $..[}:)]

Ive still got a pink fibreglass 2 piece one from the late 80's early 90's..I thought I'd rig up my 5m on it recently to have 2 sails but its heaps too long..I used to be able to rig my 4m on it but it was a 90's revo.grr its heavy too.I only started to use a modern mast 18months ago.It was 2 different masts ( top off one & bottom of other same type ) 2nd hand for $100 & still going strong.So much lighter & more user friendly!

hi sue, light people under 70 kg have a great advantage over people above that
in most conditions especially under 20 knots.

the lightweight windsurfer must also downhaul and outhaul the sail more regularly than our lardy and meaty friends who can use their incredible heft and love of kebabs and burritos to wrestle any sail into submission.

so if you are overpowered add 1cm of downhaul,and go for a run then 2 cm of outhaul and maybe try the downhaul again.
all sails rigged correctly should have 10-12 knots of usable range.

mast base position, footstrap,fin and harness line position also play a role.

Well i am 120-130 kilos and have a wind range of 10 knots to 45 knots with one trusty 5.5m sail and my sinker is 120 litres, please dont laugh i get sad..i am eating donuts right now, yummmmm

Being heavy is going to make it easier to handle large gusts, that is simple physics. (newton's laws of motion)
Being lighter is going to make it easier to make use of light winds, that is simple physics too
If the wind was very steady being lighter would make you faster and more nible in higher winds too, but in reality as the wind get stronger so do the gusts.

Here is a photo of my partner Gill from about a week ago.A 4.5 sail on a 400 mast in very gusty 30kt conditions. You can see the creases where the leach in nice and loose. Even a couple of millimeters more down haul would have worked though Gill thought the sail felt pretty user friendly. The gybe was kind of untidy but conditions were harsh, it was cold enough to make you hands completely numb and it was the first time Gill had sailed that board.

To me it looks too tight, but hard to tell without seeing it closer

you shouldn't wreck your sail by using lots of downhaul. but this is where the idea of the correct mast comes into things.

with a stiffer mast you need to put more downhaul than the sail was designed to have to get the head to twist.

the flip side of that coin is that you then get less draft which means the sail needs more wind to get going. and when powered up the sail will feel twitchy.

on top of that your stiffer head means the sails head doesn't flex as easily so your sail then doesn't handle the gusts as well by venting. and the coe will most likely also sit higher up the sail making the sail feel more powerfull which leads to stance problems.

combine those 2 things together and you have effectively reduced the useable wind range your sail was designed to work in.

some sails though (mainly wave sails) will offer more tollerance with mast stiffness.
as the luff is designed to be more forgiving. ie. a straighter luff curve. some sails even get spec'd with a 2nd option mast.

about cutting down masts. i haven't done it but i believe it makes a mast stiffer still. the usual approach however is to take the same amount from the top and bottom or something like that.


in your photo it is hard to tell if the sail is twsiting correctly? it looks to be twisting but one photo is a point in time and the sail flex is constant. to me though, the draft doesn't quite look as good as it could be. it seems a bit high and flat. maybe your sail is designed that way also. some wave sails are. only way to know for sure is to rig it with the right mast and go sailing.

edit. just read you other post. 2cm won't make much difference.

Gestalt said...

you shouldn't wreck your sail by using lots of downhaul. but this is where the idea of the correct mast comes into things.

with a stiffer mast you need to put more downhaul than the sail was designed to have to get the head to twist.

the flip side of that coin is that you then get less draft which means the sail needs more wind to get going. and when powered up the sail will feel twitchy.

on top of that your stiffer head means the sails head doesn't flex as easily so your sail then doesn't handle the gusts as well by venting. and the coe will most likely also sit higher up the sail making the sail feel more powerfull which leads to stance problems.

combine those 2 things together and you have effectively reduced the useable wind range your sail was designed to work in.

some sails though (mainly wave sails) will offer more tollerance with mast stiffness.
as the luff is designed to be more forgiving. ie. a straighter luff curve. some sails even get spec'd with a 2nd option mast.

about cutting down masts. i haven't done it but i believe it makes a mast stiffer still. the usual approach however is to take the same amount from the top and bottom or something like that.


in your photo it is hard to tell if the sail is twsiting correctly? it looks to be twisting but one photo is a point in time and the sail flex is constant. to me though, the draft doesn't quite look as good as it could be. it seems a bit high and flat. maybe your sail is designed that way also. some wave sails are. only way to know for sure is to rig it with the right mast and go sailing.

edit. just read you other post. 2cm won't make much difference.

Ive only had a few sails with that 4.2m that I have been happy with..It used to feel flat & gutless .Only lately have I been using more downhaul.It felt ok on Monday the board has been more of an issue than the sails lately..think I need a smaller fin.The board doesnt misbehave I just find the chop tiring ..or is that normal?