Pardon me if I seem ignorant here. The class 5 yachts at Rada Tilly that you posted photos of appear to contravene the rules as I understand them. With the underslung cockpit the pilots body is not fully visible when viewed from above (apparently), plus there is a small fairing around the mast step and onto the front of the cockpit.
Is this what Paul and yourself mean when you say how outdated we are in Australia? Are our rules outdated here too?
Yes I have downloaded the class rules from FISLY and I will review them.
Pardon me if I seem ignorant here. The class 5 yachts at Rada Tilly that you posted photos of appear to contravene the rules as I understand them. With the underslung cockpit the pilots body is not fully visible when viewed from above (apparently), plus there is a small fairing around the mast step and onto the front of the cockpit.
Is this what Paul and yourself mean when you say how outdated we are in Australia? Are our rules outdated here too?
Yes I have downloaded the class rules from FISLY and I will review them.
Good questions - underslung or OTT (over the top) chassis are not a new idea they have been around for some time and have been deemed ok for class 5 provided the top is not covered over with fibre glass like it is in the standarts. As to the *fairing* around the front, yes I know what you mean however it is in the interpetation of the wording by the techinical team and as you can see they have allowed this. My understanding is that this seat design is fairly common practice in Europe so...whilst you or I may think it is a fairing the judge of the day said it was not a fairing but part of the seat.
We did see a class 5 with what looked like suspension on the front it had this mini shock obsorber on the front wheel. I will try and find the photo. Paul and I were very suprised as to us this was a blatantly outside spec however the yacht passed the technical scrutineering and no-one commented or protested.
Class 5 has very much become what you can get away with and how far can you stretch the rules IMHO Promo Girl
The 'T' chassis yachts are a whole lot easier. Just stand on the axle and scoot with the sheet rope tied off tight and head into the wind. The tricky bit of course is steering but this is what the hand tillers are for. The Kiwis had it down to a fine art during PACRIM 06, but it would have been interesting to see the difference at the start if there was a decent wind to get the rest of us going.
Running starts?not a problem,childs play,.......in a blokart,hand tiller?,good idea....already got one, in my blokart...mmmmm.Sorry just rubbing it in.
Running starts sound like fun but also sounds like the place where a short race (a la blokart) will be won or lost.
Last Queensland blokart titles held at Bucasia Beach two years ago had push starts (ie pilot in kart being pushed off by someone else) which, while fun and exciting for some did not make for level playing field racing.
This was especially so when the push off line direction was the same as the wind direction and the yacht at the windward end of the push off line was also closer to the start line.
Have sailing starts as practised in conventional yacht races been tried with land yachts? This would seem to be the fairest way to start a land yacht race.
Has anybody had experience of sailing starts?
Is there a widely accepted race start format that has been found to be the most practical and fair method of race starting?
Running starts sound like fun but also sounds like the place where a short race (a la blokart) will be won or lost.
Last Queensland blokart titles held at Bucasia Beach two years ago had push starts (ie pilot in kart being pushed off by someone else) which, while fun and exciting for some did not make for level playing field racing.
This was especially so when the push off line direction was the same as the wind direction and the yacht at the windward end of the push off line was also closer to the start line.
Have sailing starts as practised in conventional yacht races been tried with land yachts? This would seem to be the fairest way to start a land yacht race.
Has anybody had experience of sailing starts?
Is there a widely accepted race start format that has been found to be the most practical and fair method of race starting?
Flying starts were done years ago but are not practical for large fleets. The widely accepted race format for starting is the Morel Grid. (see the FISLY rules for copies of the different sized grids) You use what ever grid for the fleet size. The start positions are such that over a 6 races (the minimum for an official regatta) every one had a reasonably even chance at a good start position. More races and the odds get better. Basicially you have a good start number, a bad start number and a medium start number etc etc. In everywhere *except* a couple of Australian clubs run push starts are the rule.
A good start can make a difference to a race however great pilots do well even from bad start positions so lets all concentrate on improving our skills, including starts and not *blame* a bad start position on a bad placing
We've been using the traditional yachting start for blokarts for years without problems. We can safely start 15-20 karts in a race with a 3 minute countdown on a 15m long start line. If you need to, you can scale up for larger and/or less manoeuvrable land yachts. After all, large keel boats do not have what one would call responsive steering or a tight turning circle, yet they seem to start large fleets for the Sydney-Hobart without too many problems.
Yeah, but Sydney Harbour is pretty big and you'd be surprised how quickly the large yachts can tack. They almost swivel on their keel (well not quite but you get the picture ).
yep ,your on to it hills, the standart has that as standard but only on one side.i think that it should be looked at here, if we were to lift the game, ???????????? one mod a blokart wont need
OOPs dave , as the official standart salesmanfor Australia you would know that the standart has a lovely hand steering wheel in the centre of the cockpit. when you alter the body position whilst sailing you hang on to the hand tiller and pull on the rope
For a good running start you need a hand tiller. full stop. on euro beaches the yacht basically sinks whilst your waiting to start even without your weight in the yacht so you need to get out and push. I prefer a flying start. even Sandgropers had them ( history lesson follows). John nobbs would hang out behind the fleet of yachts that were too lazy to try sailing and hit the line at full speed so it became outlawed. when the club 88 was intrduced the builder changed the steering set up and the wheel falls over when you try to push, so standing starts became the rule. I will leave the subject of Handicap starts for another day!
Bee Gee nailed it,starts are not a problem,no matter how many karts,non karters must realise that a blokart is extremely manouverable and can turn in it's own length.What a buzz it is circling with a group of karts with everyone trying to nail that start!
A while back a talked about Henri's class 2 going into the ocean at Rada Tilly during the world championships. Well of course some one filmed it and now it is on you tube. Scary stuff huh?
I can answer this. What u tube did not show was the big crash moments before between Henri's yacht and another class 2. The other pilots yacht was a mess. henri jumped out of his yacht to check the other pilot was ok, whilst he was doing this a wind shift occured and then his yacht got away. He was doing what we would all hope a fellow pilot would do to us if we had just been involved in a crash - he forgot the racing and checked on the other pilot.
Exactly right stevo and BeeGee. This is the reason I advocate flying starts, especially for blokarts.
I suspect that the same woulkd apply to the current crop of class 6/minis being built.. Having started in large fleets of class 5s on big and small venues I wouldnt advocate it at all. FISLY have worked hard to get a good starting system in the MOREL GRID. add a push and it works well, but you must build your yacht to do it, and have clear rules as to what can and cant be done. the main resistance will come from people who dont want to get out and do it and perhaps they feel that others should come back to their level?
I can answer this. What u tube did not show was the big crash moments before between Henri's yacht and another class 2. The other pilots yacht was a mess. henri jumped out of his yacht to check the other pilot was ok, whilst he was doing this a wind shift occured and then his yacht got away. He was doing what we would all hope a fellow pilot would do to us if we had just been involved in a crash - he forgot the racing and checked on the other pilot.
Ahh I see, poor bloke, just doing the right thing. How did he get it out?
Just offshore were 2 Argentinian Navy Zodiacs. They didnt rescue the yacht because they were watching the Tanned spectators at the beach rugby further down the beach and didnt notice the 9m landyacht sailing towards Africa. ( I am not joking here) Other race marshalls came down the beach and swam out to save all the gear
so lets all concentrate on improving our skills, including starts and not *blame* a bad start position on a bad placing
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