Hi everyone, I was just wondering, if my first kite is a Zenith 2 Kitesize 13 from Windtech. Review strongly recommend it only for skilled riders. What do you think?

Mikedobee said...

Hi everyone, I was just wondering, if my first kite is a Zenith 2 Kitesize 13 from Windtech. Review strongly recommend it only for skilled riders. What do you think?

Kite design has moved so quickly that it would be the equivalent to learning to drive on a tractor build in the 1920's with no brakes.

Get a decent post 2007 kite for not much more money (I assume you're looking at the Gumtree advert)
There's heaps of decent kites for less than $500 in the Buy & Sell of this website.
www.seabreeze.com.au/classifieds/default.aspx

Trant said...

Mikedobee said...

Hi everyone, I was just wondering, if my first kite is a Zenith 2 Kitesize 13 from Windtech. Review strongly recommend it only for skilled riders. What do you think?

Kite design has moved so quickly that it would be the equivalent to learning to drive on a tractor build in the 1920's with no brakes.

Get a decent post 2007 kite for not much more money (I assume you're looking at the Gumtree advert)
There's heaps of decent kites for less than $500 in the Buy & Sell of this website.
www.seabreeze.com.au/classifieds/default.aspx

Yeah. you are probably right, but price is really important to me as I am not doing very well financial wise. The lady sold it to me for 250 dollars eventually and it was used once or twice, the lines, the center loop looks new, also the kite. Therefore, I bought it. I also got a 2 m trainer kite which I am planning on trying it tomorrow morning in Botany Bay. Maybe I'll meet some friendly people for some friendly advice.

thanks.

Ok, Dave! Thanks for your advice!

Just letting you know that I actually went today on the beach with this kite and everything went great. Firstly I flu my 2 meters trainer kite for about 2 hours. I didn't yet get in the water as I don't feel confident yet, so I just launched and landed a couple of times the "worst kite" ever with the help of very friendly people actually. Even after they saw my kite. It's not easy on your arms (it has huge power), but it's actually very stable, compared to other bow kites on the beach today.

I am not stupid to launch this kite on a stronger than 15 knots wind (today were about 12 to 14 till 11 o clock) and risk my life or anyone else's safety.

I will probably not sell it, because I don't want someone to feel "sucker".

Thanks again and next time I'll be in QLD, maybe we can meet and show you what I've learner with this obsolete, lame and useless kite :)

PS: I don't need to spend a fortune on expensive trainers. I can learn by myself.

Cheers,
Mike

Bigwavedave said...

Worst $250 you have ever spent!

Not only will that kite retard your learning process, in the hands of a novice it will be outright dangerous.

Most instructors in this country have never flown a pre 2006 kite so will not teach you on your own equipment.

Sell it on ebay to some other sucker.

If you can't afford a 2006 + kite then you can't afford to be in this sport.

If you try to fly it there won't be too many friendly faces at the beach!

I wasn't clear enough in my message.

First two hours I flu the trainer kite to learn to control it.

After that, two guys from the beach offered to help me with the "dinosaur" 13 m kite to launch it and land it a couple of times and keep it in the air for a while. And

Irresponsible is probably the last thing that I am. Because as I was saying, I am not planning to use it for winds over 15 knots, 2. I am not getting in the water until I am 100% confident that I can control it properly. 3. Who cares it's an ancient release system? It works. So I can release the kite any second, if something goes wrong. 4. Of course I won't ride with it when the beach is busy.

Bigwavedave said...

Its not the trainer that's obsolete and dangerous. It's the 13m dinosaur. From the details you supplied in your original post it is not a bow kite.

The windtech Zenith 2 (2004) is an ancient weapon with no depower, antiquated safety releases and poor relaunching.

As a novice you are very irresponsible if you attempt to learn or teach yourself on this kite.

Finally, someone that gets my point!

Thanks for your words, Darki!

In terms of researching, at this point I have 7.8 GB of guides, materials, Dvds, books and bookmarks about kite surfing. I am watching heaps of videos, reading and taking all the necessary precautions in order to learn the safe way. Just because for now, I don't have the proper amount of money for a great equipment, doesn't mean I cannot learn by myself. Even though a very expensive sport, people can still try to get around the financial issue. At least, I can. :)

Plus, let's face it even in 2003, 2004, 2005 people had to learn on this kite, and I am pretty sure they had heaps of fun and they are still alive.

Cheers,
Mike

Darkspi said...

First of all hi to every one on the forum first post on here.

second Grats Mikedobee seems like your some one who has done the homework studied all that have gone before you and wants to achieve some thing for your self and not have it handed to you on a plate like most ppl these days

fair winds brother
Darki

AKS on the money right there. And on a further note if you choose to fly the "death machine" please do so on a deserted beach with nobody downwind for at least 300m . Whilst you seem happy to gamble with your own life, please be considerate of the ones who wish to enjoy the beach without risk of harm by a stubborn arrogant fool. The kiteboarding community in NSW is in constant risk of banning's, with many people just waiting for someone like you to slip up so they can ruin it for the whole community.

You made the point of "people had to learn on a kite like that at some point" but in retrospect those of us that are still fit and healthy are luck to be. those kites have "Kitemare" written all over them and are the reason many windsurfers stayed windsurfing in the late late 90's.

all the negatives aside its great that you are using a trainner and DVD's, but the knowledge, experience and safety knowledge of an instructor is priceless.

Alex

Hi AKS,

Thanks for making things clear.

Not only that I have clearly stated "I WILL NOT fly this kite on a wind stronger than 15 knots", but also said I will not use it when the beach it's crowded. So now my question: "HOW CAN YOU HURT YOURSELF EVEN WITH THE MOST DEADLIEST KITE IN THE WORLD ON A WIND WEAKER THAN 15KNOTS????? SERIOUSLY, HOW? You can barely launch the kite.

Of course in the next couple of months I will have the money a buy a proper kite, but until then I think I have the right to practice with this one, as long as I am cautious about all the aspects, right?

Further more, I understand this forum is to advertise how important it is for everyone to take lessons, after all, you guys in the industry have to make a living. I get that as well. What I don't get is why the hell they need to charge 100 to 150 dollars/hour. I have a master degree in Mechanical Engineering and the most I've charged was 60 dollars/hour and I had to study for 6 years.

Let alone the fact that I know heaps of people who learned on their own or helped a bit by friends. If they've done it, I'll do it as well. Slower, but I am not in a hurry!

As for Dave, his response was a bit more than "blunt". Not to mention the advice "Sell it on Ebay to some other sucker". I really don't care if he's been around for a while, that is not Australian of him to promote this kind of behavior on this forum and encourage people to fool others.

Anyway, I feel bad I've registered on this site. I'll make sure I'll delete my account and won't waste you or anyone else's time.

later,
M

AKSonline said...

Hi Mike,

You initially came onto this forum looking for advice. You asked a specific question in regards to the kite you have selected. You were given good (although blunt) advice from Dave. Dave has been around since the beginning in Kitesurfing in Australia and has seen and done it all in regards to schools and teaching people.

Windtech never really made a good kite which is why you probably have one of only two or three kites in the whole country.

Since the sport started in Oz ~1999, there were at least two deaths every year in Australia alone until around 2008. Most directly caused by kites similar to the one you have in your possession. The design from around 2008 onwards have made kiting much safer.

The lack of depower means in a big gust you will be lofted high up, with little experience, you will get dropped from height and suffer injury.

Despite what you read or think, you will not get to the Quick Release before the damage has been done. Many accident happened and riders were haplessly dragged down the beach into rocks or trees whilst actively yanking on the quick release or fumbling for it as they tumble end over end.

The most dangerous kiters are the ones who think they have all the angles covered and have no experience to back it up.

Why you would risk your safety trying to learn on such and old and dangerous kite is beyond comprehension. Your medical bills on even a nasty break, will greatly exceed the cost of an old 2nd hand SLE or bow kite.

But, you know best, so go right ahead mate. Buy your old kite, fly without instruction, do it on a public beach and ignore the advice of the most experienced kiters in Australia. What do we know?

In fact, after a quick think, it is clear you didn't actually want quality advice. You had been told by some other knowledgable soul that the kite you bought was a death machine and what you really wanted was validation to prop up your uncertainty over a poor choice.

In future, please specify whether you would like validation or advice. This will allow the nongs to reply and validate you, and the rest of the experienced kiters to not bother wasting precious time on someone who didn't want the advice in the first place. We can then help someone who really did want proper advice.

DM

Bigwavedave said...

With a Masters degree I would have thought you would have a little more common sense.

.....and a little more money !!

Seriously Mikedobee
Apart from all the good advise you are choosing to ignore - yep thats your right - when you make comments like-
1) "I am not getting in the water until I am 100% confident that I can control it properly.
2) "Who cares it's an ancient release system? It works. So I can release the kite any second, if something goes wrong."
3) "HOW CAN YOU HURT YOURSELF EVEN WITH THE MOST DEADLIEST KITE IN THE WORLD ON A WIND WEAKER THAN 15KNOTS????? SERIOUSLY, HOW?
it shows that all the research & data you have collected means nothing.

1) The beach is ALWAYS the most dangerous place when kiting - with any kite you like. Learning to fly your 'no depower' no 'reliable release' on the beach is the worst thing you could do. If you do persist with your plan launch as quickly as you can then get as far offshore and as far away from any obstacles & people as you can before before practicing flying.
2) You may THINK it works but wait till you need it to. I can guarantee you it WONT work under load and even if it does you will still be left with a kite thats out of control & powered up.
3) The guy who was killed on Phillip Is and the one who was killed at Safety Bay were both on smaller kites than yours, far better kites than yours (even though being of similar age) and both were out on days below 15kts. Your shouting only only reinforces the fact that you are not doing anything safely.

If as you say "you are not in hurry" and that "in a few months I'll get a good kite" why not wait till you can get your good kite. Save your Munster till you know how to kite - then think about getting your moneys worth out of it.

And pls dont get sh1tty - everyone here is trying to help. Its not their fault you dont like the very well intentioned good advice they are giving.

And one more thing - Yes we did have fun learning on our old 'no depower C kites' but I dont know ANYONE who learnt back in those days (with or without lessons) who got through it without at least one serious injury. Most of us - inc me - had several, any one of which could easily have been fatal in slightly altered circumstances.
Honestly dude - its just not worth it.
Fly your trainer till you can afford a $600 3 yr old bridled kite at least. Theres 1000's out there and there is no limit to how much a trainer can advance your learning time.
PM me & I'll send you a copy of our trainer kite learning guide. It will give you solid advice on what you need to learn to do with your trainer - directly related to kite-surfing skills.

+1 for all the above advice and in answer to the question in your original post,

Probably!!

I am not trolling mate. Just for the fact that I have selected all of the sports there, it doesn't mean I know how to practice them, it means I am interested in them. At least that's how I've seen it.

As for the advice, Woodys actually made a fair valid point without being sarcastic, bitter or malicious. That's what I was expecting when I first registered on this site.
Not pictures with recycle bins and other crap.

Thanks again, Woodys! I have a couple of videos with the stuff I need to learn with the training kite. Thanks anyway.

Promise I won't fly the Zenith. I'll probably keep it as a museum piece or give it to Kitepower store in Brighton-le-sands, I think they are collecting all the antiquities.

PS: I swear I don not know the guy who took my side.

Thanks,
M

AKSonline said...

Hi guys,

Looking at his profile, I'm pretty sure he is trolling, I just couldn't take the chance. I mean anyone who can wakeboard, snow kite, etc, doesn't need a trainer kite. Nothing he has said adds up and the one post wonder supporting him was probably an alias.

Winter is here!

DM

I definitely will. I know one guy there. He is pretty awesome and knows everything about this. I was thinking maybe get a North or Cabrina.

Does it matter the fact that it has patches? Or it's still reliable if the works are professionally done?

Thanks,
M

sbray said...

Mikedobee said...


Or give it to Kitepower store in Brighton-le-sands, I think they are collecting all the antiquities.

While you are at Kitepower store in Brighton-le-sands, why not ask if they would trade-in your ill informed purchase.

Take the quantum leap !!! buy the best, most suited kite you can.

While you are there, talk to the experienced, local kiters.

I'm not neccessarily pimping this shop, but since you are going there anyway, it just seems like an obvious solution which would give a better outcome all round.

Fossil


Fossil

Aaaaaaand......I got rid of the monster kite. I gave it back to the lady as it was basically unusable.

Yeah, I'll try to get something of around 600-700 in a couple of weeks. See what they can recommend.

I most definitely will. They seem pretty nice.

Thanks, Dave!

Bigwavedave said...

Most kites end up with patches and repairs at some stage :)

If they are professionally done and the kite is manufactured post 2006 then you will find learning a pleasurable experience instead of a constant series of punishing injuries!!!

Build a relationship with your local shop. It's in both of your interests to ride a suitable kite. All major brands have their good and bad points

Good luck with it. Get a safer kite and get some lessons. You will progress more rapidly.

As much as I don't like to admit, yes, it's not my first language. Probably that was a part of it as well.

Cheers,
Mike

djdojo said...

Mike, I'm guessing English is not your first language? (Sincere question based on some of your sentence structures)

If so I also suspect that this has been partly responsible for some of the attitude on this thread as some of the sarcasm and other culturally specific stuff gets lost in translation?

Glad you'll be heading to Kitepower for some good advice and an appropriate kite.

There is no way you are not a troll mate! Funny ****, you are like the borat of kitesurfing forums. The stereotypical Euro parody. Nice one. Forget kiteboarding, take up that wooden bat and ball game that all the Euros play in their budgie smugglers at the beach

Yeah and even for a kiwi I'm considered a little bit crazy eyed! You can go get your ass handed back to yourself on your old skool death trap kites if you like, but dont expect sympathy as bystanders film you in hope of a viral video hit while you teach yourself on the most dangerous equipment available on the market. Ever see the top hat kitesurfing video? Go check it, thats what you can look forward to on your old skool Naish 8====D