Why good riders on C kites?

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Lovely

QLD

248 posts

Lovely

QLD, 248 posts

10 Sep 2010 6:20pm

Now days there are so many different styles of kites to choose from. Flat Bows, Delta, Ramair, etc etc.
I'm curious to know why the standout guys tend to still be riding C style kites?

Is it because they are harder to use? Like strapless/strapped boards.

getfunky

4485 posts

getfunky

WA, 4485 posts

10 Sep 2010 4:26pm

Kn hell!! Here we go!!

COVER!!!!

(in before lock

)

EDIT:

They are great fun BTW - they do everything but just don't have anywhere near the range of deltas/bows/box

kites.

Like anything there are poxy shabby C kites out there too. Don't assume C kite means ace. I had great 2005 C kites that i loved to bits (literally) and bought a 2006 C kite from same company. Didn't like it at all.

All kites work and if your a noob it may well be 1-2 seasons before you even know what YOU like, so don't sweat - get out there on your box kite and enjoy.

Watch the friction light up the C kites/strapless like nitro.

Er.. also - note that I picked my 2005 C's up super cheap coz no-one would touch a C with a bargy in late 2006. Ba ha ha ha, I love fickle marketing driven kiters

BTW, I now ride bows of sort (but prefer my Cs a tad) and picked them up cheap - partly - because everyone wants Cs. Ba ha ha ha ha, I love fickle marketing driven kiters.

Lovely

QLD

248 posts

Lovely

QLD, 248 posts

10 Sep 2010 6:28pm

Thanks you're most helpful.
But why do good riders tend to use that style?
Is there something secret about the performance?

getfunky

4485 posts

getfunky

WA, 4485 posts

10 Sep 2010 4:39pm

I am nuttin spesh as far as skill levels that's for sure, but they do teach you how to be a better pilot I reckon.

You have to learn to edge like a mutha at times and must have your wits about you more than bows etc.

Any gumby can get by on a bow/delta, hence so many total peanuts out there that would otherwise be eating through a straw after a month on a C kite of old.

sir ROWDY

5378 posts

sir ROWDY

WA, 5378 posts

10 Sep 2010 4:39pm

because they work...
1. They are more direct thus provide better feedback on kite position.
2. They have no silly bridals to break or tangle.
3. They provide a consistent pull.
4. They provide better slack in the lines during handle pass moves.
5. (I actually like the way they waveride better to)

As has been said there are some bad C-kites around, but for the most part new C-kites depower nearly as much as a lot of Hybrid kites out there. There is only so much useable depower in a kite anyway, yeah old mate might be able to take his 10m crossbow IDS EXT GTR out in 40knots, but... What is he going to do with it? nothing. You still need to have the correct size kite up to unhook and do anything worthwhile doing, so what's the point of having 100% depower when it is un-useable?

In summary, good riders use C-kites because they are the best kite you can get for advanced purposes. Maybe if more people actually tried a newer C-kite there would be a lot more people out there riding them... Unfortunately most people are falsely trapped in the belief that C-kites are dangerous. In my opinion kooks thinking they can rig up there bow kite in any wind because it is "ultra safe with 100% depower" is far more dangerous.

getfunky

4485 posts

getfunky

WA, 4485 posts

10 Sep 2010 4:44pm

The only thing Rowdy is EVER serious about is C kites.

Good points he makes young padawan.

jas73

QLD

796 posts

jas73

QLD, 796 posts

10 Sep 2010 6:53pm

[That would have to be to most informative and sensible peice of advice i have ever seen posted by you Rowdy

quote]sir ROWDY said...

because they work...
1. They are more direct thus provide better feedback on kite position.
2. They have no silly bridals to break or tangle.
3. They provide a consistent pull.
4. They provide better slack in the lines during handle pass moves.
5. (I actually like the way they waveride better to)

As has been said there are some bad C-kites around, but for the most part new C-kites depower nearly as much as a lot of Hybrid kites out there. There is only so much useable depower in a kite anyway, yeah old mate might be able to take his 10m crossbow IDS EXT GTR out in 40knots, but... What is he going to do with it? nothing. You still need to have the correct size kite up to unhook and do anything worthwhile doing, so what's the point of having 100% depower when it is un-useable?

In summary, good riders use C-kites because they are the best kite you can get for advanced purposes. Maybe if more people actually tried a newer C-kite there would be a lot more people out there riding them... Unfortunately most people are falsely trapped in the belief that C-kites are dangerous. In my opinion kooks thinking they can rig up there bow kite in any wind because it is "ultra safe with 100% depower" is far more dangerous.

seafever17

360 posts

seafever17

WA, 360 posts

10 Sep 2010 4:56pm

They have consistenly had brighter colours.
Do not under estimate the importance of this.

waxman

1390 posts

waxman

SA, 1390 posts

10 Sep 2010 6:29pm

I have to agree with rowdy on this.

I would love to ride new c kites every year, but because of peoples perception of them they can be hard to sell at the end of the season. Kites like Hadlow pro's and fuels are awesome but just don't have a big second hand market they will eventually sell but can take time. SLE's and Deltas seem to sell well because some learners dont want new gear for there first kite. Once the growth of kiteboarding slows down, so will the second hand market and no matter what you fly every one will be in the same boat.

One good thing about the C kites is they don't change much year to year, you are mostly buying a tried and tested formula that will last you at least 2-3seasons before being outdated. SLE's and Deltas change dramatically every year trying to get you to upgrade.

So the Question why do the top guys ride C's? Because they are sick, the riders are more concerned with ridding than looking good with the latest revolutionary kiteing gear. They just use what works

Lovely

QLD

248 posts

Lovely

QLD, 248 posts

10 Sep 2010 7:05pm

Wow excellent tips fellas, especially from an experienced point of view.
That is a handful of great reasons to stay away from the few options I had in mind.

Its great to hear a point of view from real kite surfers and not the usual suspects talking it up in the gear review section.

colinwill78

VIC

1395 posts

colinwill78

VIC, 1395 posts

10 Sep 2010 7:26pm

waxman said...

I have to agree with rowdy on this.

I would love to ride new c kites every year, but because of peoples perception of them they can be hard to sell at the end of the season. Kites like Hadlow pro's and fuels are awesome but just don't have a big second hand market they will eventually sell but can take time. SLE's and Deltas seem to sell well because some learners dont want new gear for there first kite. Once the growth of kiteboarding slows down, so will the second hand market and no matter what you fly every one will be in the same boat.

One good thing about the C kites is they don't change much year to year, you are mostly buying a tried and tested formula that will last you at least 2-3seasons before being outdated. SLE's and Deltas change dramatically every year trying to get you to upgrade.

So the Question why do the top guys ride C's? Because they are sick, the riders are more concerned with ridding than looking good with the latest revolutionary kiteing gear. They just use what works

well said, although i'm not convinced a second hand hadlow pro is the best way for a noob kiter to get into the sport. i heard they are a great kite, best left to advanced riders ie you and NOT ME!!

Have you seen len10 videos? (particularly stormsjees 1 and 2) you can't tell me he isn't being dressed up to look trendy (euro trendy

)

waxman

1390 posts

waxman

SA, 1390 posts

10 Sep 2010 7:05pm

Hadlows, not for me either.

But would be fun in the right conditions

GanzoGirl

35 posts

GanzoGirl

WA, 35 posts

10 Sep 2010 5:47pm

C Kites give direct feedback to bar as there are no bridals.
Like Rowdy said, they give more slack when popping as the bridals don't change the angle of the kite and power the kite as quickly.
No bridals to tangle.
Bit more stable so landing blind or wrapped is easier.
Kiteloops are that little bit more powerful but the new short bridal kites are catching up in that respect.

They are hard to sell on as the market is small though.

getfunky

4485 posts

getfunky

WA, 4485 posts

10 Sep 2010 5:47pm

Lovely said...

Wow excellent tips fellas, especially from an experienced point of view.
That is a handful of great reasons to stay away from the few options I had in mind.

Its great to hear a point of view from real kite surfers and not the usual suspects talking it up in the gear review section.

All of the above are handbag salesmen and not kiters at all. Their advice on kites should not be taken seriously.

Especially that getfunky knob.

Surprised there wasn't some flaming?

Your'e a knob getfunky!!

That's better.

Er.. ignore him.

Kinda wish I had my 2005 Cs still functioning but my opportunities to actually get out there are not as plentiful as they used to be, so having bows with a little more wind range suits my needs pretty well. I did love the uber boosts on my Cs and liked wave-gumbying a tad better on them too.

On the plus side getting caught out with lulls was not fun on my 9m C but not really an issue on my 9m bow-ish kite (due to it's far superior bottom end). It's not the flatest bow out there and I liked it's slightly C-ish feel straight off too.

Horses for courses lovely.

GalahOnTheBay

NSW

4188 posts

GalahOnTheBay

NSW, 4188 posts

10 Sep 2010 7:58pm

Excellent question, thanks for asking...

If someone is on an old style C kite these days they have generally been kiting for a while and generally got to be at least ok. Most folks buying new style c kites have come from old school c kites so the same is true.

People coming in to the sport these days pretty much always get bows, because that's what dominates the market and are "learner friendly" (it is in inverted commas for a reason), hence why most noobs are bow riders (by the weight of numbers)

getfunky said...

COVER!!!!

(in before lock

)

lol - you read my mind getfunky... Lucky Rowdy hasn't found this topic yet. Oh wait...

waxman

1390 posts

waxman

SA, 1390 posts

10 Sep 2010 8:09pm

Is this really SB??????? Is everyone agreeing

There has got to be at least one brand pimp that can tell us who doesn't use a c kite in the PKRA.( but probably wish they did).

I remember when Dre rode c kites, Sick. But not much has changed with his riding, he is still sick on a SLE.

Don't trust that Funky guy, cant even agree with himself. heheheeee

sir ROWDY

5378 posts

sir ROWDY

WA, 5378 posts

10 Sep 2010 6:42pm

He rides SLE's so he can get paid...

waxman

1390 posts

waxman

SA, 1390 posts

10 Sep 2010 8:19pm

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$...........shame on him

bennie

ACT

1258 posts

bennie

ACT, 1258 posts

11 Sep 2010 12:27am

Doesn't Youri Zoon ride an RPM?

colinwill78

VIC

1395 posts

colinwill78

VIC, 1395 posts

11 Sep 2010 12:39am

What about wave "surfing" are SLE's better or more prominent in that arena.

getfunky

4485 posts

getfunky

WA, 4485 posts

10 Sep 2010 11:42pm

CLICK!

Flame suit on..

It's gonna get hot in here.

C kites don't drift..

Strapless riders lack traction

NJPornstar

790 posts

NJPornstar

WA, 790 posts

10 Sep 2010 11:50pm

I'm not a great rider but I recon C kites are better because they tend to stall less. The wing tips have a good angle of attack to the wind in all parts of the wind window. Hence grunty biting turns, which is actually desirable for all levels of kiteboarder. The wider tips seem to glide well, fly straight when depowered and give good feed back on the bar during different flying maneuvers. From my brief experiences I find a bridle of any sort radically effects the trueness of a kite.

For sure some kite designs have better bottom end than others. Amazing isnt it....The simplest solution to deal with low bottom end power kites is better board technique. (Level the board out, let it run! Stop the board stalling wasting your speed, Speed=Power) Learners don't have much board technique for the first 20 hours. That's why grunty kite designs are liked by schools and beginners.

Rule of thumb, terrific bottom end will mean less top end wind range. I've seen people totally wind ranged/T bagging on sizes they should easily be able to handle in C kites Im familiar with.

crawling back into my cave now.

Torch

521 posts

Torch

WA, 521 posts

11 Sep 2010 12:25am

was fully out of contol on my 12m X2 compaired to my 12m 2010 torch last summer, who'd have thought?

jas73

QLD

796 posts

jas73

QLD, 796 posts

11 Sep 2010 2:49am

There are only a couple of guys that ride c's around Sandgate and Redcliffe all the time and in good wind are awesome to watch. I guess because they have been riding for allot of years and know there **** when it comes to using these kites. I guess any competent rider could get on a c and fly it but understanding all the benefits of them comes with experience.

dachopper

1802 posts

dachopper

WA, 1802 posts

11 Sep 2010 7:50am

It because the C-kites are more versatile than the bows etc.....

In my experience with the bows, my biggest hate is you get constant pull, you unhook, and it gives you constant pull, the depower when you are unhooked, doesn't ( with alot of them ) allow you to maximise your speed, to create big pop... because it's allways pulling the same, so it's hard to load up, when the kite is allways loaded up like a para-glider..

Just look at cabrhina's new C kite - Nomad? .. Y did they go back?

Also, the jumps are like floating on a paraglider... and involve different skills in kite placement, that give you unpredictable results sometimes compared to C-kites.

fozzy

501 posts

fozzy

SA, 501 posts

11 Sep 2010 9:33am

That Nomad is NOT a C kite. Their claim not yours I know chopper, but their kidding themselves.

fozzy

501 posts

fozzy

SA, 501 posts

11 Sep 2010 10:59am

O.K. so I won't turn this into one of those lame arguments that this place encounters so much, but I've never seen a C kite with swept back tips and an outline like that. Check out photos of Fuels, HiFi Comps, Hadlow Pro etc if my word isn't enough.

We will have to agree to disagree. Completely in this instance.

sir ROWDY

5378 posts

sir ROWDY

WA, 5378 posts

11 Sep 2010 9:40am

It is my superior opinion that a true C-kite shouldn't need a bridal or 5th line to fly... otherwise it's a hybrid.

Lovely

QLD

248 posts

Lovely

QLD, 248 posts

11 Sep 2010 12:34pm

sir ROWDY said...

It is my superior opinion that a true C-kite shouldn't need a bridal or 5th line to fly... otherwise it's a hybrid.

I agree. I cant see how a 5th line helps a kite to fly.
I do rig up a 5th line all the time but it is rigged a little loose. Manufacturers specs.
Gets tight when the kite powers up but doesn't really help sheet the kite in and out.

Tried many bridle kites and they just feel like rubbish. I keep finding these new/old C shape kites heaps better in the waves.

Ha ha kites are all going C shape this year, what no bridles next year!

Transition_Surf

286 posts

Transition_Surf

SA, 286 posts

11 Sep 2010 9:51pm

Mr Zoon does ride the RPM with the LEN10 pro bar

sir ROWDY

5378 posts

sir ROWDY

WA, 5378 posts

11 Sep 2010 9:46pm

martynbone said...

Mr Zoon does ride the RPM with the LEN10 pro bar

Mr Zoon want to get paid

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