Welcome plummet. Been saying this for a while now, but no one seems to listen. Either tt or SB it seems for those not in the know. Enjoy the freedom man.

eppo said...

Welcome plummet. Been saying this for a while now, but no one seems to listen. Either tt or SB it seems for those not in the know. Enjoy the freedom man.

yep i here what you are saying. but people are sheep for the most part. they will follow the latest trend whether its the best direction or not.

doesn't bother me. i'll be ripping it up in my little mutant world and loving every second.

Are these all Cardboards Surf mutants you guys are riding?

Plummet said...
...

yep i here what you are saying. but people are sheep for the most part. they will follow the latest trend whether its the best direction or not.

...

That's a bit harsh given that most shops don't stock mutants and Cardboards won't let people demo their boards.

Plummet said...



yep i here what you are saying. but people are sheep for the most part. they will follow the latest trend whether its the best direction or not.

more like by 2005 everybody realised they have the least favourable traits of both styles combined into one unwieldy board.

Gorgo said...

Plummet said...
...

yep i here what you are saying. but people are sheep for the most part. they will follow the latest trend whether its the best direction or not.

...

That's a bit harsh given that most shops don't stock mutants and Cardboards won't let people demo their boards.

its not a hit at kiteboarders in general. more a dig a humans in general. they like to follow the flock rather than deviate from the norm!.

Plummet said...

stamp said...

Plummet said...



yep i here what you are saying. but people are sheep for the most part. they will follow the latest trend whether its the best direction or not.

more like by 2005 everybody realised they have the least favourable traits of both styles combined into one unwieldy board.

your probably right a 2005 mutant probably would be a terrible thing. imagine a mutant with the latest board technology. what is the limitation compared to TT? nothing. theres only advantages.

Stamp you need to get with the times buddy. I rode mutant back in 2005 and they were terrible...or I was crap, probably a combination. hence went TT/SB for 4 years, then tried the CB wave. They have evolved and I suggest you ride a couple to evolve your technical prowess.

yeah a guy at my local has an underground srf. looks nice. more on the T style than SB style by the look. i like the little surf fins. may have to get me some.

thats probably a fair assessment puppet. I'm definately not a purist wave rider. I prefer to "play" amongst the waves than endlessly smack lips down the line.

ps anybody seen any good mutant videos online? .... i can't find anything. its either freestyle or surfboard videos.

I posted this in a thread a few month ago.

I had a mutant last season, but got rid of it as I felt it had a fundamental flaw. Mutants can ride backwards, but in a compromised way, which for me felt awkward and uncomfortable. This leaves toe side which they do pretty well, but not all that much better than a freeride tt. Mutants are too small to gybe. For me riding toe side all the time gets tireing very quickly. I much prefer to gybe and ride heel side both ways and just switch to toe side when actually surfing the wave.

I also think that to get the most out of a mutant on a wave you need to have your back foot back as far as possible over the fins, but due to the small size of mutants this compromises your ability to get up on a plane as quick as you would if the foot straps were more centered over the board.(example I can get going on my 132 x 39 tt as early as my mutant 151 x 43 when the back foot strap is all the way back). As a result I think mutants are best suited for stronger wind/no good for light wind.

Don't get me wrong I think mutants work quite well for there intended purpose, but considering you spend 50% of your time riding the opposite way to your natural stance, the above mentioned issues ment this board was no good for me. I think that if you don't want to go the surfboard, a wave specific twintip such as the underground srf is the go.

Bennie.

your statement says to me you mutant was perhaps a bad one or the set up was bad. I can set mine up so its "compromised" going backwards and excellent on the wave face to as good as TT backwards and good on the wave face. my mutant goes better in light wind than my TT.. Theres no need to ride toeside everywhere if you don't want to.

captain. when you say toeside waves both ways do you mean upwind and down the line in the wave session? or when the wind changed to the opposite tack?

I have mine set up so i TT out healside SB upwind in and ride down the line toeside.

Yeh Bennie what mutant were you on? The wave rides backwards just fine and infact it blasts better upwind with the thrusters forward. As far as light wind riding the wave is actually better in the light to medium stuff as it planes quicker than a TT. Actually to add I am in the process of getting myself a TT to take my kites to their limit in higher winds as the wave planes to well! I will use a TT in balls to the walls wind, the Wave in lighter to meduim winds then i have a sector 54 for the bottom end of my kites.

Another thing not mentioned with the wave is when I hit the estuary or a real flat day on the ocean I take the thrusters out and put some TT fins in and rides as an awesome TT, looser and you can ride it both ways toeside.

I agree with having to ride toeside all the time, hence I ride the wave exactly like a TT, then hit the toes in the waves. Although it carve jibes so well, I will swing around into my toes, then quickly transition the other way on the next up stroke. There is a slight, ever so slight change of technique but nothing you can't master in one session if you know what you are doing.

Also I think a wave specific TT is an oxymoron in some sense. Tried most of them on the market before buying the Wave (as I though along the same lines) and they just don't even get close to the wave and too far away from a SB. Especially once the swell starts to ride. But some crew like that totally powered wave riding on a TT so that's cool. While you need some power on the wave, you can /kill stall somewhat in bigger swells and actually pump the wave face like a SB (not exactly the same), get into the pocket etc.

On your toes with thruster forward would need a decent change in technique if not swapping feet. I wouldn't recommend it. But if you gybe you mean swapping feet then there is no problem, why would there be, the thrusters are at the back right. ? Is that what you mean. Swapping feet on a mutant you'd need to be a gun rider though, not a much buoyancy as a SB...

Plummet said...

Bennie.

your statement says to me you mutant was perhaps a bad one or the set up was bad. I can set mine up so its "compromised" going backwards and excellent on the wave face to as good as TT backwards and good on the wave face. my mutant goes better in light wind than my TT.. Theres no need to ride toeside everywhere if you don't want to.

perhaps it was a bad mutant, or perhaps I am correct. Real mutants (directional rocker/ offset stance) by nature are designed to favour one direction, therefore the other direction will be compromised.

As for lightwind performance, I got plently out of mine when I had it set up like a tt, buts whats the point of that, its supposed to be semi directional. So back foot as far back as possible over the thrusters for wave riding and it was very "wind hungry" and really struggled to get up on a plane in the lighter stuff, not to mention it rode like a dog switch in this setup.

If you have your backfoot too far back on a smallish board eg mutant stlye its physics that your back foot will bog down and kill your early planing power, thats why the small surfboard trend of a few years back ended so quick

bennie said...

I posted this in a thread a few month ago.

I had a mutant last season, but got rid of it as I felt it had a fundamental flaw. Mutants can ride backwards, but in a compromised way, which for me felt awkward and uncomfortable. This leaves toe side which they do pretty well, but not all that much better than a freeride tt. Mutants are too small to gybe. For me riding toe side all the time gets tireing very quickly. I much prefer to gybe and ride heel side both ways and just switch to toe side when actually surfing the wave.

I also think that to get the most out of a mutant on a wave you need to have your back foot back as far as possible over the fins, but due to the small size of mutants this compromises your ability to get up on a plane as quick as you would if the foot straps were more centered over the board.(example I can get going on my 132 x 39 tt as early as my mutant 151 x 43 when the back foot strap is all the way back). As a result I think mutants are best suited for stronger wind/no good for light wind.

Don't get me wrong I think mutants work quite well for there intended purpose, but considering you spend 50% of your time riding the opposite way to your natural stance, the above mentioned issues ment this board was no good for me. I think that if you don't want to go the surfboard, a wave specific twintip such as the underground srf is the go.

This just about summs it up for me too. I have a RRD toxic wave in the shed which I pull out on realy wind days, I love the radical carves you can throw while on the wave, but riding it toe side is a pain, and riding it back wards is no fun. Its too small to gybe so my strapped surf board is a better option for me.
There may be better reverse riding mutants out there, but I feel they then compromise on the waveriding side. Might as well get a twinn tip then.