loop at top of sail luff sleave

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baywavebill
baywavebill
VIC
266 posts
VIC, 266 posts
13 Jun 2011 8:34pm
I am after one of those straps that can be sewn onto the top of a sail's luff sleave so that I can use the sail with a longer mast than recommended. Asked at my local shop (SHQ) but they did not have any. Any suggestions where I can get one or what they are called?
I realize I will not get optimun performance but it is a 4.2 sail that I will only use once or twice a year and I can't justify spending $500 or more on a good quality mast that I will seldom use.
baywavebill
baywavebill
VIC
266 posts
VIC, 266 posts
13 Jun 2011 9:09pm
Make that 'sleeve' not 'sleave'. Ohh dear and I'm a teacher!!!
BarryFawkes
BarryFawkes
NSW
149 posts
NSW, 149 posts
13 Jun 2011 9:40pm
Take it to a sailmaker I had a couple done in the old days I used old sailworks plastic head caps but if you dont have one they can make a pouch out of the webbing
Waiting4wind
Waiting4wind
NSW
1871 posts
NSW, 1871 posts
13 Jun 2011 10:19pm
Neil pryde used to have an extender strap, not sure if they still do. It was an accessory for their smaller sails. I think I may have one somewhere.
Mark _australia
Mark _australia
WA
23652 posts
WA, 23652 posts
13 Jun 2011 8:24pm
If SHQ said "nah we don't have any" but did not even suggest a sailmaker would have some from old sails or could make one, or even suggest the NP extension strap.... then I'd not be going back to SHQ again

WindmanV
WindmanV
VIC
821 posts
VIC, 821 posts
14 Jun 2011 9:09am
Good morning, Bill,

The NP extender is not sewn into the luff, rather, after removing the fitted mast plug, the extender is looped around the webbing that the mast plug was affixed to. You then fit the mast plug to the extender, rig the sail and adjust the extender to suit.

The extender relies on friction to stop the extender from expanding under load. From sad experience, I found the friction clamp was not enough and it slipped whilst on the water. The solution was to tie an overhand (shoelace) knot in the material coming out of the friction clamp, close to the clamp, so that if the clamp does slip, it can only go as far as the knot.

Sounds complicated, but very easy to set up.

If SHQ don't have one, you might try the NP dealers in NSW and Qld to see if they can help, otherwise conatct NPMaui, who seem to have a wide range of NP accessories.

Hope this helps.
Mark _australia
Mark _australia
WA
23652 posts
WA, 23652 posts
14 Jun 2011 8:14am
I have the same deal with the webbing slipping but find if I push the sliding barrel across so it locks tight, whilst somebody else downhauls, it helps it lock up.
Basically you give it a hand to get in the right position to lock up as first time it is used the webbing is a little slippery and has not enough friction to move the sliding bit into place.
You need to only do that once and there is no more slippage after that as it is locked up
WindmanV
WindmanV
VIC
821 posts
VIC, 821 posts
15 Jun 2011 9:04am
BWB,

Attached is a photo of the NP mast extender.



As shown, it extends the mast by about 400mm (less when the strap is threaded through the rollers).

Hope this helps.
keef
keef
NSW
2016 posts
NSW, 2016 posts
15 Jun 2011 10:43am
WindmanV said...

BWB,

Attached is a photo of the NP mast extender.



As shown, it extends the mast by about 400mm (less when the strap is threaded through the rollers).

Hope this helps.

i have one of those on my 4/6rs, just remove the mast plug from the webbing at the tip of the sail and thread the strap through the webbing and attach the plug to the loop extension

stehsegler
stehsegler
WA
3571 posts
WA, 3571 posts
15 Jun 2011 9:58am
Baywavebill,

You might want to try this out first. I recently did that for a 4.2 as well to see if it would rig on a 400 mast. Short answer is it didn't. The mast was simply to stiff.
keef
keef
NSW
2016 posts
NSW, 2016 posts
15 Jun 2011 4:40pm
stehsegler said...

Baywavebill,

You might want to try this out first. I recently did that for a 4.2 as well to see if it would rig on a 400 mast. Short answer is it didn't. The mast was simply to stiff.


stehsegler your rite but it's a mater of trial and error ,works in some cases and sometimes make the sail perform better, the rs4/6 recommends a 370 mast with a 22cm base and the luff is 391, now with that set up the mast is too soft and the sail depowers to quick, i use a rdm 400 0 base and a loop about 8cm with that set up it gives the sail more bottom end and the top works better, the sail is tight as a drum and being rigged on a rdm the rotation is heaps better
GazMan
GazMan
WA
848 posts
WA, 848 posts
15 Jun 2011 9:56pm
baywavebill said...

I am after one of those straps that can be sewn onto the top of a sail's luff sleave so that I can use the sail with a longer mast than recommended. Asked at my local shop (SHQ) but they did not have any. Any suggestions where I can get one or what they are called?
I realize I will not get optimun performance but it is a 4.2 sail that I will only use once or twice a year and I can't justify spending $500 or more on a good quality mast that I will seldom use.


Either Ian at Sails & Windsurfing Centre or John at Stuart Bell Sails in Perth would surely have one, I think the correct name is 'adjustable head turban'. Ian fitted one to my NP 4.4 Combat a number of years ago, unfortunately sail did not rig or perform very well after the 'operation' so beware if it's an NP 4.2 you're wanting to modify! Ever wondered why NP don't use adjustable heads on ANY of their modern sails? Local NP dealer told me that they stuff up the leech twist if used on NP sails, pretty much what happened to mine!

However, if the recommended mast for your 4.2 is constant curve and not flex-top then 4.2 with adjustable head may still work ok on longer mast.
Mark _australia
Mark _australia
WA
23652 posts
WA, 23652 posts
15 Jun 2011 9:58pm
GazMan said...

baywavebill said...

I am after one of those straps that can be sewn onto the top of a sail's luff sleave so that I can use the sail with a longer mast than recommended. Asked at my local shop (SHQ) but they did not have any. Any suggestions where I can get one or what they are called?
I realize I will not get optimun performance but it is a 4.2 sail that I will only use once or twice a year and I can't justify spending $500 or more on a good quality mast that I will seldom use.


Either Ian at Sails & Windsurfing Centre or John at Stuart Bell Sails in Perth would surely have one, I think the correct name is 'adjustable head turban'. Ian fitted one to my NP 4.4 Combat a number of years ago, unfortunately sail did not rig or perform very well after the 'operation' so beware if it's an NP 4.2 you're wanting to modify! Ever wondered why NP don't use adjustable heads on ANY of their modern sails? Local NP dealer told me that they stuff up the leech twist if used on NP sails, pretty much what happened to mine!


Only if you overdo it.
my 4.2 Combat uses the strap pictured above and I drop it down the mast about 6cm or so and it sets wonderfully
GazMan
GazMan
WA
848 posts
WA, 848 posts
15 Jun 2011 10:09pm
Here's what it looked like:


GazMan
GazMan
WA
848 posts
WA, 848 posts
15 Jun 2011 11:58pm
baywavebill,

If your 4.2 has a recommended mast of 370 and you want to rig it on a 400 then possibly would be ok, though if you wanted to rig it on a 430 then that could be disastrous! Very much depends on the length and type of mast recommended for your 4.2 as well as the mast you plan to use in it (whether it's bend curve and stiffness would work with your 4.2, particularly with an adjustable head fitted).
WindmanV
WindmanV
VIC
821 posts
VIC, 821 posts
16 Jun 2011 1:13pm
All,

I used the mast extender for many years, rigging a 4.0 NP wave sail on a 400 mast when the rigging spec called for a 370 mast. Didn't want to buy a new mast and so I put up with the 4.0 sail being very much "Off" or "On" in power with very few days where it pulled constantly. Never had a problem downhauling the sail using a normal hand puller.

Two years ago, bit the bullet and bought an X3/370 and the difference in the sail handling was amazing, even though the mast was bottom-of-the-line.

Wouldn't recommend the extender based on my own experience, but can understand why they are used.

Hope this helps.
baywavebill
baywavebill
VIC
266 posts
VIC, 266 posts
16 Jun 2011 6:08pm
Thanks for all your advice guys. My sail is a 4.2 NP Firefly which recommends a 370 mast. I was hoping to get away with using the 400 XCombat mast. Looks like it can be done but with a real compromise but if its only 1 or 2 times a year I might prefer to spend the $500 a 370 mast would cost, elsewhere. ???? Worth a try with the extender just to see as it will not cost much.
ginger pom
ginger pom
VIC
1746 posts
VIC, 1746 posts
18 Jun 2011 9:51am
Hi Bill

how much sticks through the top?

The pryde sails are notorious for having luff lengths of 398cm...

Rig it on the 400 and see what it looks like

ps hope you're well.. bumped into Becky on the train the other day and said I hadn't seen you in a while.
baywavebill
baywavebill
VIC
266 posts
VIC, 266 posts
18 Jun 2011 8:10pm
ginger pom said...

Hi Bill

how much sticks through the top?

The pryde sails are notorious for having luff lengths of 398cm...

Rig it on the 400 and see what it looks like

ps hope you're well.. bumped into Becky on the train the other day and said I hadn't seen you in a while.


Not sure what you mean?? Are you saying try it without the extension strap?

Missed the last big wind but had a great trip up to Melville Is (north of Darwin) Great windsurfing spot if it wasn't for the darn crocs and stingers.
jsnfok
jsnfok
WA
899 posts
WA, 899 posts
18 Jun 2011 8:46pm
baywavebill said...

Thanks for all your advice guys. My sail is a 4.2 NP Firefly which recommends a 370 mast. I was hoping to get away with using the 400 XCombat mast. Looks like it can be done but with a real compromise but if its only 1 or 2 times a year I might prefer to spend the $500 a 370 mast would cost, elsewhere. ???? Worth a try with the extender just to see as it will not cost much.


get a 4.2 with a vario top, or a 4.5 and 4.7 to justify buying the mast
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