large fins on US box and narrow tail

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joe windsurf
joe windsurf
1482 posts
1482 posts
14 Jan 2012 11:12pm
last summer {winter here now with 1 foot snow} i purchased a Fanatic Ultra CAT longboard for light winds
it planes around 10 knots with my 100 kilos

in bigger winds, when the centreboard is raised , it is obviously fin dependent
it has a carbon 30 cm/1 foot fin with a long/wide chord
i find it takes long to turn and was thinking about longer fins
the board is only about 33 to 34 cm one foot forward
have read and heard fin should be no longer than OFO width
is this true ??

www.GSPORT.com seems to have long freeride fins with US box
also read or heard US box is not made for longer fins
is this true ??

also heard or read, with US box if you move fin forward, you get more steering
and back for "control"
is this also true ??

looking for a lot of truth here
that's why i always say windsurfing is like a religion
WindmanV
WindmanV
VIC
819 posts
VIC, 819 posts
15 Jan 2012 9:44am
Good morning, Joe,

You might get more responses posting on the iWindsurf Forum.

Can't comment about the OFO vs. fin length. In the old days, the OFO measurement wasn't part of the board specs.

Sadly, I started sailing in the era your question concerns and can recall a number of US box failures as fins got bigger, so suggest that you go no bigger than a fin length of about 32cm (the biggest offered on 1992 Bic boards). The boxes just weren't designed for big sideways forces generated by big fins and that's why the Tuttle, Power and Trim boxes were invented. By the way, if you do go big and you hear a CRACK whilst sailing and the board suddenly goes sideways, you'll instantly know that you've gone too big.

Re fin position in the box. Those race boards were made for going (relatively) fast in a straight line and only needed to complete (perhaps) 8 gybes before the race was over. Is there really a need to get excited about fin position on a board 3.5m long and if there is, why don't you alter the fin position (full forward vs full aft) and try to feel the difference?

Hope this helps.
decrepit
decrepit
WA
12873 posts
WA, 12873 posts
15 Jan 2012 8:59pm
Agree with windman.

I've turned a few US boxes just using small wave fins, and I'm only 70kg. Big fins and US boxes don't mix unless special methods have been employed to stop them turning.

I think the OFF thing is more of a guide than a rule set in concrete. A heavier person should be able to control a longer fin than a lighter person, in the same board. And it's easier to control a bigger fin when underpowered, or going up wind.

Don't think you'll notice a lot of difference in fin position with a board that big, except if it allows you to move it too far back so it sucks air. Then you'll spin out when you put pressure on it.
joe windsurf
joe windsurf
1482 posts
1482 posts
15 Jan 2012 9:25pm
okay then, is it worth converting the US box to a power box ??
as seen here

decrepit
decrepit
WA
12873 posts
WA, 12873 posts
15 Jan 2012 9:51pm
Depending on the material of the outer skin. If it's fibreglass/carbon sandwich construction, yes it's possible
If it's the older style moulded plastic, I wouldn't try it. There isn't enough adhesion between that old plastic and epoxy resin.
joe windsurf
joe windsurf
1482 posts
1482 posts
15 Jan 2012 9:59pm
in the video clive just jams it in , locks it in place with the old mould and then glues it

i guess the idea is - am i ready to take a chance or just enjoy the board as is !!
and forget bigger than 32 cm fins

the board planes up early and feels fast - big heavy speedster like the cars of that time :-)
decrepit
decrepit
WA
12873 posts
WA, 12873 posts
15 Jan 2012 10:15pm
Hmm see what you mean. He does make it look very easy, but first you have to get the old box out. If it's the same as that, with a nice completely sealed cavity, the exact size of the new box. Then yes it's probably worth it.
But if there's anything different in there, you may just ruin the board all together.
Beaglebuddy
Beaglebuddy
1595 posts
1595 posts
16 Jan 2012 2:07pm


also heard or read, with US box if you move fin forward, you get more steering
and back for "control"
is this also true ??

With a surfboard the general rule is move the fin forward for quicker turning and further back for stability and speed down the line, I would think you would want that fin as far back as possible.

WindmanV
WindmanV
VIC
819 posts
VIC, 819 posts
16 Jan 2012 7:01pm
Good morning, Joe,

I have a JP 92 FSW with PB and here are some measurement measured at the PB bolt hole that might help you:

Top of board to bottom of board, 70mm

Width of board across bolt hole, 300 mm

Tail of board to bolt hole, 195mm

So, if you take the measurement of the Cat at the centre of the US finbox and you are under these measurements, I think your project may be doomed.

You might ask the box swap question on the UK Boards Forum (http://boards.mpora.com/forums/) in both the Racing and Equipment sections. In the Boards Racing section, you might also care to check out the answers regarding what specs are used to make a Raceboard go fast.

If you get a positive result to the box swap, you might try The Boardlady/finbox for fitting instructions here: www.boardlady.com/jppowerbox.htm

Don't know how close to a good board repairer you are, but if the project goes ahead, you might get it done professionally.

Hope this helps.
Gestalt
Gestalt
QLD
14954 posts
QLD, 14954 posts
16 Jan 2012 11:53pm
i wouldn't worry about swapping out the finbox unless you can't find fins. i'm not sure if your board has one of those exotic boxes some long boards had.

just stick a narrow chord 30cm fin in for when the winds up and the wide chord one when the winds not up. the narrower fin will help your turns but to be honest the stiffness you describe is more about the rocker/rail shape.

i'd just get the narrow chord fin and be done with it or buy a different board. a lot of guys, myself included used to use finworks fins in our raceboards. they were half decent fins.

maybe try something like that.
joe windsurf
joe windsurf
1482 posts
1482 posts
17 Jan 2012 9:38am
thanx to all

the next board was a Fanatic Mega Cat which apparently had the PB
it was more of a race board and the Ultra is the ultimate "funboard" and yet racy

the current fin is full carbon and has a VERY decent chord
have other US box fins with less chord - did NOT realize they would be more "turny"

will have fun next summer trying the fin placement and narrower chord fin

thx again
joe windsurfer

WindmanV
WindmanV
VIC
819 posts
VIC, 819 posts
17 Jan 2012 6:47pm

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M-m-m-m-m, Finworks fins




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