With the iron ore price hammered and the world headed for a depression is the port still going ahead? What is the latest you Gero rad lads?

Where do you reckon the newly released Uranium deposits will be shipped from

Maybe I'm missing the big picture but I just can't see Oakagee getting off the ground anytime soon, Iron ore has all but ground to a halt in the midwest and they are still talking about building the new port. The costs involved in building the port are mind boggling, just the outer harbour work was reported to be over $650 million, and all this for an industry that has fallen in a hole and in a very uncertain economic climate.

cranky said...

Maybe I'm missing the big picture but I just can't see Oakagee getting off the ground anytime soon, Iron ore has all but ground to a halt in the midwest and they are still talking about building the new port. The costs involved in building the port are mind boggling, just the outer harbour work was reported to be over $650 million, and all this for an industry that has fallen in a hole and in a very uncertain economic climate.

Don't forget the inland Uranium Mines that could ship out of the midwest port, Geralton infrastructure and particularly a large port, is seen as very important strategically for WA's future, and it's only a matter of time. I hate the fn idea.

I'm sure it will happen eventually, just not anytime soon. I don't know about the uranium, would they spend a couple of billion to build a port just for uranium? I dunno, does everyone realize how big this project would be if it happened? 0 infrastructure, ugly terrain in and out of the water, sjit loads of limestone and more swell than they want 12 months of the year, it's going to swollow up some cash.

cranky said...

I'm sure it will happen eventually, just not anytime soon. I don't know about the uranium, would they spend a couple of billion to build a port just for uranium? I dunno, does everyone realize how big this project would be if it happened? 0 infrastructure, ugly terrain in and out of the water, sjit loads of limestone and more swell than they want 12 months of the year, it's going to swollow up some cash.

Now that there is a "downturn" there will be plenty of big Caterpillar front end loaders available to come and dig up that limestone and relocate it to the sea wall.

the "ugly terrain" is a walk in the park for these guys, have a look at some of the terrain they are mining around Tom Price, Newman etc.

a billion dollars to create the port will be recouped in no time flat once they start selling uranium.
the greenies (no not Greenroom, the tree huggers) of the world will eventually demand that we go nuclear (how ironic) because it will be the "greenest" option. Solar and Wind just wont cut it in the near future (next 50 years).
I'm against it also, but once these guys get going, there wont be any stopping them.

I have mixed feelings about building a port at Oakagee, which I will not be talking about here. As to whether the port/rail will be built:

A couple of points (my opinion only).

Infrastructure such as port and rail networks take a long time to build. Mining/minerals industries have always been cyclical industries (according to AusIMM "average, “bull” markets last for 5.4 years while “bear” markets last for 1.3
years". Meaning that even if they started building now they would finish after this period of crappness caused by greedy US bankers.

Projects cost less in downturns (like a lot less) and government backing for such projects will be higher (because they create jobs, stimulate the economy, etc). Projects cost less because there isnt as much competition for resources (such as equipment and labour) plus engineering and construction companies will probably quote cheaper prices for projects because they wont be in such high demand as the are during boom times and will have to compete with one another.

The recovery stage after this downturn is predicted to be something pretty spectacular (regardless how long you think this downturn will last), because countries are still developing and urbanising - demand will come back as soon as the money and confidence comes back. In this climate supply will drop dramatically (mines will close, companies will go bust, financing for new mines dissappears) meaning that when the money does come back, and with it demand we will again see a huge shortage of supply v. demand.

grumplestiltskin said...
the greenies (no not Greenroom, the tree huggers) of the world will eventually demand that we go nuclear (how ironic) because it will be the "greenest" option. Solar and Wind just wont cut it in the near future (next 50 years).

I'm probably classified as a 'greeny' doing natural resources management at uni (but I consider myself a (semi-) informed realist with enviro morals, as opposed to a hippy that often campaigns for stupid stuff like saving roos that should be culled)

I say no to Uranium, the only thing green about it is the fuel rods on the Simpsons

Hoping for a nice mix of renewables, even coal is better then that atm (and don't get me started how rooted that situation is)

But yeah, to realism, the govt is gunna invest in Aus research and products, it takes visionaries like Swarzenegger to do that, our govt is muted puppets (read: Garrett).

So your surf and crays are rooted unfortunately

That sucks, I wanna see or move to WA one day

Having actually wave sailed there for well over 10 years,the energy this section of coast GENERATES and recieves will cause some major change and energy deversions. GOOD LUCK ...........THERE WILL BE A LOT OF PROBLEMS.

This energy just dosnt disapear

I was taken back to see a BRIEF animation (correct or incorect) on the (abc)? of the size of the break wall. WITH 2 ships passing each other and a second following another in.

I agree with the above POSTES...........................

ANY WAY Life is short ..............so enjoy it ...................Spot x rocks

FilthyAmatuer said...

cranky said...

FilthyAmatuer said...

I have mixed feelings about building a port at Oakagee, which I will not be talking about here. As to whether the port/rail will be built:

Why not talk about it? I find a better balance from open discussion than from the propaganda rolled out by the opposing sides.

I guess you have to trade off the good with the bad. I havent made my mind yet as to weather it is a good or a bad thing, because really it is a bit of both. Maybe instead of blatantly oposing the project people need to approach the managers of it with a more open minded, lets solve this problem approach.

I agree, my soul is anti development and anti everything that more and big development bring with it to Geraldton, but in turn that makes me a hypocrite because like so many in Geraldton I derive my income indirectly from mining

the greenies (no not Greenroom, the tree huggers) of the world will eventually demand that we go nuclear (how ironic) because it will be the "greenest" option. Solar and Wind just wont cut it in the near future (next 50 years).

actually quite the opposite...
... the "greens" in Germany have been fighting nuclear power since the 80s with a lot of success. Most European countries are now in the process of exiting nuclear power. The main reason is that most countries have run out of room to store the toxic waste left once the elements are spent. Yes you can re-bread them but the waste left from that process is even more radioactive.

BTW, if the entire world would switch to nuclear power the Uranium resources would be gone in approx 20 years. The highly radio active waste on the other hand won't be safe for the next 65,000 years.

Personally, I pretty much will cross Gerladton from my travel itinerary if Uranium shipping will go ahead in that area. I was in Europe when Chernobyl blew up. Although we were 5,000 km away the radio active count in some sand pits was up 10 times the safe levels. I hate to think what the Uranium dust would do to your lungs once it gets blown around be the SWer.

Talking to a few people I'm pretty sure Oakajee has been put on hold indefinately.

RIO bought Alcan, and were gonna split up Alcan and sell the parts of that business that they didn't want, to fund the Oakajee project. However thanks to economic downturn, they can't sell the parts of Alcan they want to fund the Oakajee Project.

swoosh said...

Talking to a few people I'm pretty sure Oakajee has been put on hold indefinately.

RIO bought Alcan, and were gonna split up Alcan and sell the parts of that business that they didn't want, to fund the Oakajee project. However thanks to economic downturn, they can't sell the parts of Alcan they want to fund the Oakajee Project.

oops, sorry got it confused with something else.

stehsegler said...

Its not like shipping loose lead ($0.50 a pound as a metal !) either - I think they seal the U Oxide in drums, not treat it like wheat !

yeah, cause everyone in the Uranium industry first and foremost has peoples health in mind...

... I could send you some medical articles with photos from survivors of Chernobyl and many other Uranium related accidents... you'd probably choke on your dinner though.

Get one thing right Australian mining companies don't have the best track record when it comes to Uranium spills.

Not so hot a record on shipping lead either (It was supposed to be in sealed bags but wasnt) - Esperance in case everyone doesnt get what Im referring to.

Sorry - your right, it wasnt supposed to be bagged.

It was meant to be pellets not "powder" - I knew there was something not done right

From http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,20867,21504950-5006789,00.html

Four DEC officials inspected the port weeks before the first shipment of lead concentrate from Esperance on July 4, 2005. None noticed that lead stored there was in dusty powder form, not pellets, as described in the port's environmental licence.

Alannah MacTiernan

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