If you can't beat them....

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oldie
oldie
VIC
356 posts
VIC, 356 posts
19 May 2008 1:12am
Just wondering how I would spend $750,000 on wind power.
Not on a Wotrocket.
Saw a tantalizing glimpse on some TV trailer of a sailor darting around on the waves with a small kite with very short lines, about 5 meters, it seemed.
What brought this on was an incident today where I stripped a thread in my Bic mast base connection and bits flew everywhere. Stuck on a sandbar I juryrigged a rope from front of the board to each footstrap with the mast bottom in between. Surprised to find I was planing home quite happily with the rig half a meter in the air.
Maybe somebody should go back to basics with an open mind and see what eventuates..
nebbian
nebbian
WA
6277 posts
WA, 6277 posts
18 May 2008 11:21pm
Wow! That's... cool

It was seriously half a metre in the air? So the bottom of your extension was up in the air, above the deck of the board? I wouldn't have thought the forces would let it.

Hmmmm....
oldie
oldie
VIC
356 posts
VIC, 356 posts
19 May 2008 2:29am
Worried about a hole in the board, no harness, one hand holding mast, trying to slip air under the sail. Dogma insists that gap should be closed for efficiency, but maybe some wind power could go into reducing weight on the water or somesuch..
Bloke here hasnt sailed since his mast came out and left him semi conscious on the board with a broken nose. New base is wise move..
oldie
oldie
VIC
356 posts
VIC, 356 posts
7 Jun 2008 1:55pm
Haven't tried to repeat the setup cos I wasn't actually "happily" planing.
Was desperately hoping to get within swimming distance of shore before the slipknots finished slipping or the increasing wind blew me flat.
Now I read from mr Hanson (Windwing)
" I think that perhaps someone should take a Formula board out, and take a kite on some short lines and see what they can do. Tom Magruder with his WindWeapon was an interesting idea, the Skimbat is an interesting idea, kitesurfing, these are all kind of heading down the same path."
A kitesail would either need very long lines or very short ones.
Anyone know interesting links?
Greenroom
Greenroom
WA
7608 posts
WA, 7608 posts
7 Jun 2008 8:51pm
DAM71 said...

Sounds like you jerry rigged a kite wing of sorts.

These have been around for some time. I've seen them mainly with land boards and snowboards - never on the water. But anything is possible - check this out.



My brother is a kitewinger
I will let him know you were asking

Greenfinger
Greenfinger
WA
239 posts
WA, 239 posts
7 Jun 2008 9:25pm
Put that sucker on some 20m lines (like 4 of them) and get it under controll and it would be a good thing.
P.S. Replace the ally framework with inflateable bladers would prolly help aswell
oldie
oldie
VIC
356 posts
VIC, 356 posts
8 Jun 2008 8:21am
One could also argue that hang gliding made a big leap forward by swinging on long lines and providing an armchair so one could land sitting down.
Some advances end up as deadends [}:)]
Traditional ice sailors would use their body as part of the leading edge of the sail but enclosing themselves in the wing did not take off.
Using extremely high skates to get up into the wind was a bit sus.
Windsurfing rigs on a ski platform were so so.
But must look up a Nat Geographic article where they stated that simple skis with Skimbat sail (as above) was the fastest on ice.
NotWal
NotWal
QLD
7436 posts
QLD, 7436 posts
8 Jun 2008 11:09am
Skis on ice? Is that a typo?

The bloke in the photo appears to be riding a directional kite board. That looks like it might be fun combining some of the attributes of windsurfing and kiting. Small fins? I guess the Skimbat rig would be much more responsive than a kite and still allow big boosts but you would't be doing dangly 360s. I'd like to see him gybe and I'd like to see how fast he goes. As I see it, the geometry of the Skimbat wouldn't allow it to be over about 5 sq m at a guess otherwise you'd be dragging a wing tip in the water. I wonder how they get that wing tip to stay down, wing warping?

If it snowed here I'd get one.
Wingnutter
Wingnutter
WA
62 posts
WA, 62 posts
9 Jun 2008 9:29am
Hi fellas Im the W.A. Kitewinger agent and the 'Skimbat' you are refering too is 5.5m in wing span.The 'Skimbat' was the 2007 model kite, the new 2008 5.5m is called the 'Rage' now. The kitewing that is specially designed for the water is called the 'wave warrior' and it is 7.5m in span. It gybes and tacks like a champ, not problems there. There is no problem what so ever with getting overpowered, you can instantly depower to neutral if you get scared :) The water version of the kitewing is brand new to australia and I have the first two in W.A. anyone want a demo let me know!! Today would be a nice day for a fly i read the newspaper forecast saying destructive squalls up to 65knots Yee Haa. The world record speed on a kitewing so far was travelling at 50knots. There is nothing bad about these kitewings they are well designed and are a very high performance alternative to other wind sports. You actually do accelerate like you do when you throttle a motorbike. Here is two links to the wave warrior for yous





enjoy
Haircut
Haircut
QLD
6491 posts
QLD, 6491 posts
9 Jun 2008 12:15pm
oh dear - dingle dangle for windsurfers

howdy wingnutter

if a bunch of folk zipping along next to each other and the guy upwind decides to bail the sail?. Would the sail clean everyone up down wind of him?

what happens when you dig the bottom of the sail into the water? do you kind of catapult onto it? lots of protruding bits to kebab yerself on

ta

btw - i'd reckon it'd give you a decent set of washboard abs
Greenroom
Greenroom
WA
7608 posts
WA, 7608 posts
9 Jun 2008 10:18am
Hey Wingnutter. Are you going for a kitewing today?

Fellas Ive tried one of Wingnutters kitewings and it was in the backyard with gusty winds and Im telling you they deffinately have power. Very similar to the feel of a sail but seems to have the feel and power like a kite.
Wet Willy
Wet Willy
TAS
2317 posts
TAS, 2317 posts
9 Jun 2008 12:29pm
Wow! Kind of cool. "Kind of"... but what's it like having to hold the bloody thing up over your head all the time? One slip and it flies away...you could almost try it with a windsurf rig, perhaps if you show up at the beach and realise you've left your mastfoot at home... like, when you carry a rig on the beach in strong wind, perfectly balanced so the wind holds it up. Someone should try doing it on a big, stable board. Post videos here!!
Greenroom
Greenroom
WA
7608 posts
WA, 7608 posts
9 Jun 2008 10:37am
Wet Willy said...

Wow! Kind of cool. "Kind of"... but what's it like having to hold the bloody thing up over your head all the time? One slip and it flies away...

Ive seen wingnutter hold the rig and he could probably explain it better but you can hold it with one hand... almost with one finger! They are super stable! But once you sheet in with your back hand... POW! It turns on. And as for rig flying away you can put a leash on it

oldie
oldie
VIC
356 posts
VIC, 356 posts
9 Jun 2008 1:53pm
The reflex strap is pretty neat.
I think that the inline skater (not hooked in, note ) in the "record" video was happy that it flew away when he blew it. It flew very efficiently on its own (and quite dangerously too). Flying away probably minimizes damage both to kitewing and pilot.
A deadly effect with towed hangliders is "lockout" where increasing sideforce makes it bank further increasing the sideforce etc. The wing-in-ground effect here would help a bit but when a glider goes you have got to go with it. No way to unhook in that situation.
A good agent might post some water crash videos (hint) just to show how it can be safely done with a leash.
Wet Willy
Wet Willy
TAS
2317 posts
TAS, 2317 posts
9 Jun 2008 2:10pm
So, how much does one of those rigs cost? How big is it when it's all packed away?

One thought - it might be a good change for those with back probs from too much windsurfing. Also good cross-training, and it would show the kitey-poos that you don't really need 20m lines...
Jezza
Jezza
WA
22 posts
WA, 22 posts
11 Jun 2008 11:34am
Hey guys, just stumbled on this and thought i'd put my few bob in. Been riding kitewings for about 5 years now and they are top fun. I can only vouch for land riding, primarily dirtsurfers, mouontainboards and skateboards. I was put onto them by a windsurfer. As far as "holding it up" goes, once you have gained some apparent wind, it flies itslef quite easily and it becomes a cross of sailing and flying where you more or less fly the wing through turns and your body and board follow, main strength used is sheeting in (easily fixed by using a harness). Greenroom is right, they do have some grunt and once you get used to the feel of it, can be taken out in any wind over 15knots as you can just let go of your rear(sheeting) hand, and it will point into the wind and just glide there producing no power at all. You can get the odd flyaway, but this only really happens when you let go of your front hand before your back hand. This can be easily avoided by the use of a wrist leash that attaches to the front end of the boom which is where the neutral point is. They also have great upwind capabilty too, on land i can almost ride directly upwind say at about 10-15 degrees. They pack up into a bag which i would assume is just a little longer than your standard sail bag? (say about 5 feet long).
I have tried both kitesurfing and windsurfing and would say they are nothing like kitesurfing at all and very close to windsurfing. I suppose the only simularity between kitewing and a kite would be the lack of mast. They have a very intuative feel to them and very easy to learn. I've seen windsurfers pick them up and fang off straight away.

I've been keen to get one out on the water, but i'm a bit suss on the kitewing board they made for it, seems a bit small, but I have seen a clip of some fellas in maui using what seems to be a smaller windsurfing board with a standard 5.5 and they were fangin.

cheers,
dropping ya a pm wingnutter
Wingnutter
Wingnutter
WA
62 posts
WA, 62 posts
12 Jun 2008 1:32pm
Hi peoples hey the Australian Importer for Kitewing has a website with Vids,Pics,Prices of all the latest gear. It is at www.firebee.com.au and If you are in W.A. contact me for sales. Greenroom and Jezza sound like they got a bit of a kitewing bug :) It is definately a cross between flying a kite and sailing a sail, best of both worlds. Keep your eyes peeled for me surfing the wave warrior at scarborough beach.
Wet Willy
Wet Willy
TAS
2317 posts
TAS, 2317 posts
12 Jun 2008 6:42pm
oldie said...

allowed to link to other sites? nothing new under the sun..



Man, that's CRAZY!! They were really experimenting in those days, eh? That looks like the same thing, but with a mast. Homemade?

If you were handy, you could make a kind of V-shaped mastfoot thing which would join two windsurf rigs at the bottom, like a giant butterfly, with a spave to connect the boom...ah...seems a litle more complicated than that...um...anybody tried making one?
NotWal
NotWal
QLD
7436 posts
QLD, 7436 posts
12 Jun 2008 7:11pm
Wet Willy said...

oldie said...

allowed to link to other sites? nothing new under the sun..



Man, that's CRAZY!! They were really experimenting in those days, eh? That looks like the same thing, but with a mast. Homemade?

If you were handy, you could make a kind of V-shaped mastfoot thing which would join two windsurf rigs at the bottom, like a giant butterfly, with a spave to connect the boom...ah...seems a litle more complicated than that...um...anybody tried making one?


That's the "Wind Weapon" I think (am I wrong?). An account I read said they were great for jumps but they couldn't land them.

As for tying 2 rigs together - it has been done. Dunno what happend.
waveslave
waveslave
WA
4263 posts
WA, 4263 posts
12 Jun 2008 8:45pm


lol.
How did they invent the Kitewing ?

They got a Wind Weapon and then lost the 5ft mast.


oldie
oldie
VIC
356 posts
VIC, 356 posts
13 Jun 2008 7:22am
I am too thinking sell the car or the wife and buy one.
Fly on the sea or the snow all year .


harry potter
harry potter
VIC
2777 posts
VIC, 2777 posts
13 Jun 2008 4:04pm
C'mon guys you are getting closer.
Just swallow your pride and buy a kite.

you know you want to
Sailhack
Sailhack
VIC
5000 posts
VIC, 5000 posts
13 Jun 2008 4:42pm
harry potter said...

C'mon guys you are getting closer.
Just swallow your pride and buy a kite.

you know you want to


I know I'm gonna cop flack for this but..........that is GOLD!


Sailhack
Sailhack
VIC
5000 posts
VIC, 5000 posts
14 Jun 2008 11:34am
I knew the red thumbs wouldn't be far away.....
russh
russh
SA
3027 posts
SA, 3027 posts
14 Jun 2008 11:40am
harry potter said...

C'mon guys you are getting closer.
Just swallow your pride and buy a kite.

you know you want to


by the sounds of things you need to swallow more than just your pride to buy a kite




your dignity, intelligence and a few other things . -
waveslave
waveslave
WA
4263 posts
WA, 4263 posts
14 Jun 2008 3:46pm
Greenroom said...



My brother is a kitewinger



If it hasn't got strings.....
it ain't a kite.
It's just a wing.
How could you ride waves with that thing....?
the wingtip would stick into the waveface.

decrepit
decrepit
WA
12873 posts
WA, 12873 posts
14 Jun 2008 7:06pm
maybe you just hold it above your head and surf the wave, getting air off every lip!
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