I've been kiting for many a moon and I love a good downwinder....
I was wondering why I never see windsurfers doing down wind runs?

mathew said...
yeah - but it is a bitch walking back after sailing downwind for 400kms... :)

But seriously, what happens when you blow out a kite, or the strings snap... rely on the emergency services to pick you up?

If you are going to mow-the-grass, you might as well land where you can get back to your vehicle.

400 ks? Really?
I guess I'd get to shore, pack down and catch a bus back to my car....
Isn't mowing the grass just tacking back and forward as opposed to travelling a distance down wind?
Anyone else have just a normal answer?

BennyB12 said..

............

Anyone else have just a normal answer?

Macroscien spoke..

I guess the definition of normal changes depending on which planet you live.

I suppose it's got a bit to do with gear size, come time to head back up to the start point. Something you teabag gets have over us I guess, all being able to jump in one car with all your gear. Having said that, there's nothing really stopping us, it just means everyone has to do the trip back to the finish point with their car.

I have heard of a couple of windsurfers that organise downwinders, but not regularly like kiters do.

I think the main thing is the gear - never dawned on windsurfers to do it as 3 peoples' gear in one car is a PITA.
Do-able, but annoying.

Dave we are probably less efficient heading upwind in the surf as we have no lift to get over waves so often there is a voluntary schlogging in the break as bearing away to get planing loses you too much ground. use the water out the back to get upwind.
Once well powered though it is easier.
Once out of the surf I guess the upwind ability is similar...? Seems to be

I agree that the style of riding lends itself more to DW'ers .........so it just happened naturally due to wakestyle roots I guess.... whereas wndsurfers were doing what surfers do (just faster and better )
referring to waveriding only which is what your DW'ers are all about right?

AUS1111 said..
www.lancelinoceanclassic.com.au/

At which I do believe the windsurfers were way faster - even with a longer course.

The downwinder would have to be on a reach? To go directly downwind as SUPs do would be ridiculously uncomfortable. I sail on plenty of onshores & although with strong winds, it doesn't take much to get out, it's an effort to go back in. You need to unhook, sheet out & hold your body in a twisted shape - not much fun...much more fun going across the wind imo.

Mark _australia said..

AUS1111 said..
www.lancelinoceanclassic.com.au/

At which I do believe the windsurfers were way faster - even with a longer course.

if i remember it was alot calmer as well :0

id say because its not that hard to get back up wind on the windsurfer and there is only so long you can go hard off the wind before you get totally worn out . Why do you d them on kites anyway

I think you guys enjoy down winders as the Kite has similiar characteristics to a spinniker ( often refered to as a kite ) which is for down wind sailing .

The windsurfer has only a mainsail and therefore going directly down wind is its least favourable leg .

The same goes for Cats you will rarely see them go directly down wind , they will work there way down the course by gybing and siting on a shy reach .

I think that may be the normal answer your lookiing for .

I can appreciate your love of them from skiff sailing there is nothing better than running downwind on trapeze with the spinniker set

Carantoc said...

BennyB12 said..

I've been kiting for many a moon and I love a good downwinder....
I was wondering why I never see windsurfers doing down wind runs?

Do you ever go upwind first ?

I always prefer a downwinder where I go upwind first. Upwind for say an hour, then back down wind to get back to the same spot I started at so I don't have to hitch back to the car.

And how far out to sea do you go ? When I see kites going downwind they stay about 50m from shore. OK if you are surfing downwind, but if you aren't surfing down then what's wrong heading out a little ?

Yep plenty of windsurfers in Perth who'll tack upwind the length of Melville water from peli point, then do the downwinder back.

A windsurfing downwinder is over too soon. I guess with the painfully low speed of kites it makes it worthwhile.

BennyB12, BennyB12, BennyB12

It seems you have confused many an old windsurfer here.

A 'downwinder' isn't sailing 180 degrees downwind, as if you were hoisting a spinnaker pulling up the centreboard.

It simply means setting off from point A and finishing at point B, some distance down wind of where you started. During that trip, generally of a couple of hours (although it could be many hours or even many days) you may well sail upwind, straight reach, broad reach, long gibes, ride a wave etc. etc. Just, on average, after the fat lady has sung you end up further down wind than when you started. At which point you walk / hitch / catch your pre-arranged lift back to point A (or stay at point B if that takes your fancy).

The point of a downwinder ? Presumably either :
a) Travel a distance see the world, experience new places and have a nice time
b) Ride ****ty beach breaks front side (or down wind on a kite) without having to worry about either riding backhand / upwind or tacking back up wind to catch the next wave.

Most windsurfers perspective is probably either :
a) For sure go downwind, see new places, but why a downwinder and not an upwinder (you can do the same), and then why not an up / down or down / up winder and save the bit about hitching / arranging lifts etc.
b) If you are riding a decent peaking , walling wave, why leave it to go somewhere else, why not just sail back up to the peak and ride the next one ?


I too now recall the gun-run as it was called on Maui back in the old days. Hookipa to Kanaha. And many years ago I sailed many downwind trips, upwind trips and down wind surfs. There is a place in the old country that rips at about 14 knots on a big incoming tide. You can broad reach for 6 hours and never move from the same spot. Downside is that the outgoing tide is unsailable.

These days I find it just as rewarding to go up / downwind (or down / upwind if you are brave and more confident) than just going down wind and have to start organising other things.

But yes, a good downwinder is probably under rated and ill appreciated by many a sailor.

saltiest1 said...
love a good long downwind run and rarely are they long enough. dawesville to halls head is a good one on a good breeze in summer with a vehicle, a couple of mates and a patient wife.

Very patient wife I'm guessing?

We do a couple every year as warm up for the LtL / ocean classic. We usually do them from leighton / dutchies to scrab.

I remember doing on last year with Tom and robbie. I think they were on 7somthing and I was on a 9.4 KA race. As we headed off from dutchies I was well powered up and they were slugging along. As we passed city beach the wind had picked up and they were powering along and I was waay overpowered - I could not hold on heading down wind and could only sail up wind. Ended up on the beach half way between city beach and Scarborough .. Very tired! Luckily I could hitch a ride with one of the dog walkers and she dropped me at Scarborough..

I would deff recommend making sure that you bring flares, mobile telephone etc in case you get separated!

sboardcrazy said...
I used to do them on Lake Macquarie. Sail upwind on our boat then get dropped off and sail the length of the lake.Don't have a boat now + gear more fragile and complicated to carry these days.
I think we did one with a car shuffle from Nobby's to Dixon Park once back in the 90's- not a lot of distance but the wind was generally stronger at Nobby's than Dixon Park which would make things more difficult.

I've done the downwinder from nobbies to dicko many times, mainly in the late 80s. A 3/4 reach is really good fun, especially in the open ocean. Also in the 87 I did a down wonder over 7 days from Mackay to Airlie Beach, via Brampton, Goldsmith, Lindeman, Hamilton and Daydream Island. These days I often work upwind on my longboard and enjoy a great downwinder coming home.