Chuck windsurfing in Australia - where?

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pierrec45
pierrec45
NSW
2005 posts
NSW, 2005 posts
4 Apr 2011 4:09am
Hey guys, just for the hell of it: that was Charles windsurfing for us in Oz.
Some sites say 1978, another 1979.

I doubt the 1978: there are pics of him in 1980 on a board and he looked like a beginner, whereas on the pic there is some style in a bit of a breeze.

He was in Melbourne 1978 (Menzies funeral in May), but doubtful. Then twice in Perth in 1979, and probably elsewhere. One caption says 'probably Perth' - good guess.

So question is: where? Sure don't look like the well known windsurfing places we know and love in Sydney, but things were different then. If Sydney, perhaps (long shot) Rose Bay or the old Harbour before Darling.

But likely Perth, right? With the bathers on, musta been summer months...




pierrec45
pierrec45
NSW
2005 posts
NSW, 2005 posts
4 Apr 2011 5:02am
Bah, got me own answer.

There are pics of him on the beach in Perth, with the same thong, summer 1979.
Hair style and all, the pic has to be from Perth. So the mentions that was 78 must be wrong, and the pics from when he was learning in 1980 must be wrong too.

Unless of course he owned only one pair of bathers, which I doubt (as I did for a while when I was poorer then ).
KenHo
KenHo
NSW
1353 posts
NSW, 1353 posts
4 Apr 2011 8:51am
No, it was definitely in Sydney Harbour.
Wasn't there some stunt where a shiela ran up and gave him a pash too on that day ?
pierrec45
pierrec45
NSW
2005 posts
NSW, 2005 posts
4 Apr 2011 9:02am
KenHo said...

No, it was definitely in Sydney Harbour.
Wasn't there some stunt where a shiela ran up and gave him a pash too on that day ?


Damn, are you as old as I am?

Said sheila was one Jane Priest, in Perth December 1979. I vaguely remember hearing of the stink afterwards.

Thems were the days when there were 5-digit phone numbers still in use in Sydney !
KenHo
KenHo
NSW
1353 posts
NSW, 1353 posts
4 Apr 2011 9:19am
Probably about the same age. JUst youngstersm sompared to teh average Aussie windsuffererererererererer.
Consider though, how young Charlie looks in that pic, compared to how old the bugger is now.
I remember the fuss, and I'm sure I read later that it was a set-up.
Pretty sure the sailing is on the Harbour though.




pierrec45 said...

KenHo said...

No, it was definitely in Sydney Harbour.
Wasn't there some stunt where a shiela ran up and gave him a pash too on that day ?


Damn, are you as old as I am?

Said sheila was one Jane Priest, in Perth December 1979. I vaguely remember hearing of the stink afterwards.

Thems were the days when there were 5-digit phone numbers still in use in Sydney !



Wet Willy
Wet Willy
TAS
2317 posts
TAS, 2317 posts
4 Apr 2011 11:59am
Wow! Charlie windsurfed - in the 70s! That is awesome! I had no idea he was so cool!
Richiefish
Richiefish
QLD
5612 posts
QLD, 5612 posts
4 Apr 2011 12:04pm
Chuck is one of us !!! Or we are many of Chuck ??
Wet Willy
Wet Willy
TAS
2317 posts
TAS, 2317 posts
4 Apr 2011 12:43pm
Windsurfing - the sport of kings!
barn
barn
WA
2960 posts
WA, 2960 posts
4 Apr 2011 11:04am
whats he doing?
Windxtasy
Windxtasy
WA
4019 posts
WA, 4019 posts
4 Apr 2011 11:42am
I think my Dad still has a pair of bathers just like that.
KenHo
KenHo
NSW
1353 posts
NSW, 1353 posts
4 Apr 2011 1:50pm
He's just sailing.
Those old Wally's had a baggy sail, like a flipping spinnaker, and they weighed a ton. They did not get up and plane, so they were always dragging, needing you to lean back against the pull of the sail like that.
He was doing pretty well for probably his first time windsurfing at all. No harness or straps back then either.
It was all very much a novelty for everyone.


barn said...

whats he doing?


Mark _australia
Mark _australia
WA
23651 posts
WA, 23651 posts
4 Apr 2011 2:01pm
The "received" stamp on the left side says 3 Nov 1979

Clues, clues...
barn
barn
WA
2960 posts
WA, 2960 posts
4 Apr 2011 2:26pm
What this Royal Dimwit is doing, I have decided, is closer to dinghy sailing than todays windsurfing.. So I formally block any attempt at embracement of this quack charlitain amongst the ranks of True Windsurfers.. If you do not concede to this stance, it's only because my arguments are too subtle and sophisticated..

charlie nooooo
pierrec45
pierrec45
NSW
2005 posts
NSW, 2005 posts
4 Apr 2011 4:29pm
Mark _australia said...

The "received" stamp on the left side says 3 Nov 1979

Funny, I couldn't make out the date, good on ya.

Now, say he was sailing mid-day, meaning a south-side shade, then the wind was westerly. But an off-shore is rare in Sydney at that time of the year, so he was probably in Perth then.

Case closed? (was fun)
KenHo
KenHo
NSW
1353 posts
NSW, 1353 posts
4 Apr 2011 5:42pm
I googled it, and that asserted that the pic was taken in 1978, but does not specify the place.
The pic of him with Jane Priest shows him running out of the surf, while in the background of the sailing pic is a marina or dock, suggesting it's a different location
FormulaNova
FormulaNova
WA
15100 posts
WA, 15100 posts
4 Apr 2011 5:52pm
barn said...

What this Royal Dimwit is doing, I have decided, is closer to dinghy sailing than todays windsurfing.. So I formally block any attempt at embracement of this quack charlitain amongst the ranks of True Windsurfers.. If you do not concede to this stance, it's only because my arguments are too subtle and sophisticated..

charlie nooooo


Hmmmm.... subtle and sophisticated arguments aside,

non planing sailing, not hooked in, a brightly coloured sail, strange footwork, and only one hand on the boom.

If I didn't know any better, I'd think Charlie is the precursor of freestyle, and the rest are just following in his footsteps

If we could see the fin we would probably see he has cut it down and is probably sailing backwards anyway. Ahead of his time...

Mobydisc
Mobydisc
NSW
9029 posts
NSW, 9029 posts
4 Apr 2011 8:24pm
That boom doesn't look like its attached to the mast.

Its a pity Dianna wasn't into windsurfing. They would have been a great couple and by now the kids would have gotten into it.
barn
barn
WA
2960 posts
WA, 2960 posts
4 Apr 2011 7:16pm
Whatever he's doing has no style, perhaps he's copying the silhouette printed on the sail?

FormulaNova
FormulaNova
WA
15100 posts
WA, 15100 posts
4 Apr 2011 7:53pm
barn said...

Whatever he's doing has no style, perhaps he's copying the silhouette printed on the sail?


You are right, I think he was better at wave sailing.



FormulaNova
FormulaNova
WA
15100 posts
WA, 15100 posts
4 Apr 2011 8:12pm

but not so good at freestyle



Chris 249
Chris 249
NSW
3573 posts
NSW, 3573 posts
4 Apr 2011 11:44pm
KenHo said...

He's just sailing.
Those old Wally's had a baggy sail, like a flipping spinnaker, and they weighed a ton. They did not get up and plane, so they were always dragging, needing you to lean back against the pull of the sail like that.
He was doing pretty well for probably his first time windsurfing at all. No harness or straps back then either.
It was all very much a novelty for everyone.


barn said...

whats he doing?


They can certainly get up and plane. The only time I've used a GPS on a "modern" One Design it hit 25.4 knots (top) and 22+ (10 seconds) in completely cruddy conditions. In the right conditions I reckon an original could get mid 20s, and that's well and truly planing.

KenHo
KenHo
NSW
1353 posts
NSW, 1353 posts
5 Apr 2011 8:09am
I'm not talking about modern One Designs.
I'm talking about a Wally in 1978-80, with a sail like Grandma's knickers, huge dagger board, and a floppy plastic fin.
I'd like to see the GPS track of an original Wally doing 25kts, no harness or foot-straps and original sail.
I learnt to sail on one, I remember.
Sure they would hook along in strong wind. I used a harness (life-jacket with marlin hook), but with no straps, I was always on the edge of disaster. But that was unusual. In that pic, Charlie is slogging.
His sail is raked a bit too, and with the big daggerboard, it's trying to round up, and he's trying to stop it.



Chris 249 said...

KenHo said...

He's just sailing.
Those old Wally's had a baggy sail, like a flipping spinnaker, and they weighed a ton. They did not get up and plane, so they were always dragging, needing you to lean back against the pull of the sail like that.
He was doing pretty well for probably his first time windsurfing at all. No harness or straps back then either.
It was all very much a novelty for everyone.


barn said...

whats he doing?


They can certainly get up and plane. The only time I've used a GPS on a "modern" One Design it hit 25.4 knots (top) and 22+ (10 seconds) in completely cruddy conditions. In the right conditions I reckon an original could get mid 20s, and that's well and truly planing.




pierrec45
pierrec45
NSW
2005 posts
NSW, 2005 posts
5 Apr 2011 8:29am
KenHo said...

I'm not talking about modern One Designs.
I'm talking about a Wally in 1978-80, with a sail like Grandma's knickers, huge dagger board, and a floppy plastic fin.
I'd like to see the GPS track of an original Wally doing 25kts, no harness or foot-straps and original sail.
I learnt to sail on one, I remember.
Sure they would hook along in strong wind. I used a harness (life-jacket with marlin hook), but with no straps, I was always on the edge of disaster. But that was unusual. In that pic, Charlie is slogging.
His sail is raked a bit too, and with the big daggerboard, it's trying to round up, and he's trying to stop it.

Shape of old ones is exactly the same (different materials) as the modern ones, once you pull out the dagger, which you would in strong winds anyways. 1980 onwards with alum booms, the shape of old Dacron sails would be quite nice and the board could plane on a broad reach. Problem was that the sail would lose its useful shape after very few outings.
The North American version had a much stiffer skeg, not the flimsy Bombora one, that helped too.
Wet Willy
Wet Willy
TAS
2317 posts
TAS, 2317 posts
5 Apr 2011 12:16pm
Anyway...I find that this has completely turned around my negative view of the monarchy, and I am now a proud and loyal subect.

If and when Charles eventually gets promoted to the top job, I think I'll have that photo printed and framed and proudly displayed on my mantelpiece. If and when I eventually get a mantelpiece, that is..
KenHo
KenHo
NSW
1353 posts
NSW, 1353 posts
5 Apr 2011 1:30pm
Different materials makes a huge difference, and Chucky was in Australia, so he would have had the soggy plastic skeg.
Those old Wally's weighed about 25kg (someone will quote an exact correct weight , I'm sure). What does a modern one weigh ?
Charlie's sail looks a bit blown out on that pic too.
Not knocking, just trying to explain why he looks like he does.




pierrec45 said...

KenHo said...

I'm not talking about modern One Designs.
I'm talking about a Wally in 1978-80, with a sail like Grandma's knickers, huge dagger board, and a floppy plastic fin.
I'd like to see the GPS track of an original Wally doing 25kts, no harness or foot-straps and original sail.
I learnt to sail on one, I remember.
Sure they would hook along in strong wind. I used a harness (life-jacket with marlin hook), but with no straps, I was always on the edge of disaster. But that was unusual. In that pic, Charlie is slogging.
His sail is raked a bit too, and with the big daggerboard, it's trying to round up, and he's trying to stop it.

Shape of old ones is exactly the same (different materials) as the modern ones, once you pull out the dagger, which you would in strong winds anyways. 1980 onwards with alum booms, the shape of old Dacron sails would be quite nice and the board could plane on a broad reach. Problem was that the sail would lose its useful shape after very few outings.
The North American version had a much stiffer skeg, not the flimsy Bombora one, that helped too.



Chris 249
Chris 249
NSW
3573 posts
NSW, 3573 posts
6 Apr 2011 6:05pm
KenHo said...

Different materials makes a huge difference, and Chucky was in Australia, so he would have had the soggy plastic skeg.
Those old Wally's weighed about 25kg (someone will quote an exact correct weight , I'm sure). What does a modern one weigh ?
Charlie's sail looks a bit blown out on that pic too.
Not knocking, just trying to explain why he looks like he does.



Modern Wallys weigh around 21kg (board only). The older ones were about the same - I still have one in excellent condition and I think I weighed it once, although I'm not sure.

I'm 99.9% sure that the Wally in Australia used the same material (cross linked poly over foam core) from 1977-ish until 2010, when a slightly different form came out at the same weight and stiffness.

The originals are very competitive with the current boards up to about 8-10 knots of wind (although the rigs do feel wobbly) and can certainly plane. I want to get a GPS onto one, it's just a problem of finding the room to keep yet another board at home rather than in storage.

Hausey
Hausey
NSW
325 posts
NSW, 325 posts
7 Apr 2011 10:10pm
KenHo said...

I'm not talking about modern One Designs.
I'm talking about a Wally in 1978-80, with a sail like Grandma's knickers, huge dagger board, and a floppy plastic fin.
I'd like to see the GPS track of an original Wally doing 25kts, no harness or foot-straps and original sail.
I learnt to sail on one, I remember.
Sure they would hook along in strong wind. I used a harness (life-jacket with marlin hook), but with no straps, I was always on the edge of disaster. But that was unusual. In that pic, Charlie is slogging.
His sail is raked a bit too, and with the big daggerboard, it's trying to round up, and he's trying to stop it.


Chris 249 said...

KenHo said...

He's just sailing.
Those old Wally's had a baggy sail, like a flipping spinnaker, and they weighed a ton. They did not get up and plane, so they were always dragging, needing you to lean back against the pull of the sail like that.
He was doing pretty well for probably his first time windsurfing at all. No harness or straps back then either.
It was all very much a novelty for everyone.


barn said...

whats he doing?


They can certainly get up and plane. The only time I've used a GPS on a "modern" One Design it hit 25.4 knots (top) and 22+ (10 seconds) in completely cruddy conditions. In the right conditions I reckon an original could get mid 20s, and that's well and truly planing.







There mightn't have been GPS around in those days, but it wouldn't surprise me if old Wally could have done 25knots!
If I can remember back to those times and pulling out the centreboard and putting it over your arm and flying down wind. You knew you were going fast when there was no water flying out of the centreboard case and really fast when the fin used to feel like it was just hanging in there!!
pierrec45
pierrec45
NSW
2005 posts
NSW, 2005 posts
7 Apr 2011 11:47pm
Pure gutfeel, and not that I care about those boards or others just planing, but I believe they would get to 25, with the right conditions. One CT249 knows better though.

Conditions would be: a top racer type, surely a Chris and not me. The AD999 sail format (what they called fatheads then), a good shape sail, not the baggy ones. Most likely on a broad reach.

I took one out for the heck of it at a freestyle comp I was at about 3 years ago, when I was healthier for these things. Went from short to retro-long in about 10 minutes.

Wind was a steady 20 knots. I was easily planing with a really old, damaged triangle Mylar sail. I am pretty, pretty sure I was planing too with my back to the sail too for a while, which I'd never done before. A racer type (I don't care about these things) woulda done a lot better than me too.

Having said that, the crowd had a real laugh... most kids had only ever heard of those old rigs, nor ever seen a railride. I think the oldest there was a PWA type at 23yo...
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