Comment in the latest Mario Kumpel video and not surprised. He's always been a reluctant windfoiler it feels like.
Just when I thought this was another crackpot who shared my feelings, the video below came up on my youtube feed - other than a Robby Swift profile, the most recent PWA video. Does it feel like Patrik's dominance (plus the Phantom implosion) has done a number on the performance side of windfoiling? I've got nothing against fins and the healthiest ecosystem would have both fin and foil racing. If nothing else, no one wants to return to the days of competitors sitting on a beach waiting for 15 kts.
(As an aside, after the dreadful Sail GP races in Sydney, some pundits even mentioned using electric drives to get the boats going. We aren't the only branch of sailing where a lack of wind plays a big role in the success of the sport.)
i started windfoiling 2019, stopped SL-windsurfing completely 2020/21, tryed and learnt (but stopped) winging 2022 - and now I own the AEON set (almost complete) with FMX and PD Foil-Sl Boards, powerd by PD HA-Race and GT3-Foil-sails.
Do I care, what happens in the PWA racing regarding the big "Foil-backlash"? No, not at all.
Do I care, that now 2026 these very large freerace or some very wide SL-boards boards are presented to be again the hottest **** on the market? No, not at all.
But one thing, I know for sure. After so many many days on the beach's (i started 1983) waiting for the breeze, for the gust, for my 30 minutes of enough wind to glide with my SL-Boards - i will never return from Windfoiling back to the fin at low- oder medium windrange conditions.
Select to expand quotet36 said..
i started windfoiling 2019, stopped SL-windsurfing completely 2020/21, tryed and learnt (but stopped) winging 2022 - and now I own the AEON set (almost complete) with FMX and PD Foil-Sl Boards, powerd by PD HA-Race and GT3-Foil-sails.
Do I care, what happens in the PWA racing regarding the big "Foil-backlash"? No, not at all.
Do I care, that now 2026 these very large freerace or some very wide SL-boards boards are presented to be again the hottest **** on the market? No, not at all.
But one thing, I know for sure. After so many many days on the beach's (i started 1983) waiting for the breeze, for the gust, for my 30 minutes of enough wind to glide with my SL-Boards - i will never return from Windfoiling back to the fin at low- oder medium windrange conditions.
Our paths are very similar. I'm more just amused by what appear to be efforts to rewrite the narrative. Plus, I'm waiting for gear optimized for "jumping the sausage". 
Interesting discussion.
I would have to agree with your observations about a shift back to the fin.
I think the windsurfing industry is worried that they have lost out to wingfoiling in the foiling department and hence the pivot back to the fin.
In terms of racing, it seems like the pwa is pursuing this dream of becoming the next 'f1' or a return of the glory days. Not gonna happen. They should instead focus on building a grassroots industry. IQ foil has an excellent numbers of participants. I have always felt that the iq racing is great (but poor coverage) and the pwa races are poor to ok (but decent coverage). A pwa format similar to iq (1 board, 8.0 sail, 1 foil, slalom & course racing) would allow all of those iq foilers to participate and really drive up the grass roots numbers.
Foils lower wind limits for competition. How about a PWA/ ITW Windfoil wave competition.
Mario prefers fin and is most likely paid to be an influencer for windsurfing, not wind foiling so something to keep in mind. I'm not sure why these should clash and tbh, on a lake in the middle of Germany, I think anyone should own a foil if you want to make the most out of the conditions.
I've done windsurf foiling but switched to wing foiling for low wind days instead. It's super slow, but it's just more convenient for me as it's less of a hassle and the gear is compacter. I also like that it's just different to windsurfing, although there is a lot of overlap and some folks like Guy Cribb see it as the evolution of windsurfing. I don't agree on that, as there's nothing like the sensation of fin windsurfing, but I can see where he's coming from. That said, the foil is amazing, and a sensation on it's own, just different. Guess it's high octane (fin) versus serenity (foil), though some people go foiling in 30 knots days.
I think these disciplines can all live next to each other. The market is small but in places where there's light winds, its packed with foilers. In places with decent windy conditions, you still see that fin generally dominates. I would love to see both Slalom X and foil racing at the PWA, depending on the places they go. While I don't watch the Olympic foiling races, I think PWA races are amazing to watch. Admittedly the foil racing can be more exciting as these things still explode at random times, guaranteeing some dramas.
Select to expand quotePaducah said.
I'm waiting for gear optimized for "jumping the sausage".
That's what she said...
Mario is young. I'm closer to his dad's age, who wings. Let's visit Mario again in 10 years.
We all ride what we can depending on conditions and time available. Recently I have been more windsurfing than foiling as we had quite a few really hardcore windy days (over 40kt sometime 50). But windFoil is still my main usual game, and I don't feel like switching to winGing (though I am winging once in a while when no other gear is available). IMHO, the 'industry' is stalling on the windFoil gear because brand (and most rider as well) completly missed the easy going style opportunity. They focused on high end performance. So yeah PWA is only one thing. Now there is definitly another trend toward 'foilstyle' (and that can be simply carving flat water waveriding style curbs, lot of fun and feeling) led of course by Baltz and Grisley.
Select to expand quote6u1d0 said..
IMHO, the 'industry' is stalling on the windFoil gear because brand (and most rider as well) completly missed the easy going style opportunity. They focused on high end performance.
Uhm, remember the time where almost any freeride windsurf board suddenly had a "foil approved" box? The brands did see the opportunity I think, but not sure if the market interest was there.
Apart from the fact that it might not make much sense to stick a foil in a normal windsurfing board, the brands pushed hard.
Select to expand quoteptsf1111 said..6u1d0 said..
IMHO, the 'industry' is stalling on the windFoil gear because brand (and most rider as well) completly missed the easy going style opportunity. They focused on high end performance.
Uhm, remember the time where almost any freeride windsurf board suddenly had a "foil approved" box? The brands did see the opportunity I think, but not sure if the market interest was there.
Apart from the fact that it might not make much sense to stick a foil in a normal windsurfing board, the brands pushed hard.
True, but that was before they realized there was way more profit[/b] in selling everyone a foil, a dedicated board, and a quiver of (fragile) wings-rather than just selling a foil to use with the boards and sails we already owned...
Select to expand quoteptsf1111 said..
remember the time where almost any freeride windsurf board suddenly had a "foil approved" box?
I do remember, but they also pushed forward low aspec crapy foil. And though it can be a solution to get into foiling, you need to scale down sub 2m length at some point : but it was only done when winGing came into the game.
I'm currently on the fence about coming back to windfoiling from winging, my wings all need replacement and it seems like parawing might fit that use case when there are waves with windfoiling being preferred on flat water.
I still enjoy regular windsurfing.
The last board I windfoiled was a 4-in-1 Hypernut which I also used for WindSUP in waves. I miss that versatility but no way I could use something with that little volume these days and it wasn't brilliant for anything.
The 4-in-1 concept doesn't exist anymore from what I can tell. Although there is a seller with an old stock Exocet Ride 4-in-1 on the shelf but they want a pretty dear price to ship it across the country.
I guess what I'm saying is I don't need to "push" anything these days, I wanna cruise and work on my carving moves when the water is flat. Sorry for the ramble.
Nico just dropped a new video and admitted he's hardly been on a windfoil in months. At least he's back on - a shiny new toy will do that. Looking at the results of Trofeo, I'm wondering how much less interest in PWA foiling is because so much of the talent is in the IQFoil pool, instead? www.trofeoprincesasofia.org/en/default/races/race-resultsall
Select to expand quotePaducah said..
Nico just dropped a new video
Same problem : he says you need a big wide board, specific sail, expensive top end foil... and that is true for race winDfoil. But also this leads those who never tried winDfoil to think it's the only way : cumbersome, expensive, and for high end top riders. VS winGing that is still somewhat easier. No doubt this will keep winDfoil a niche sport.
Though, as some have seen the potential with foilStyle windsurfing, and used gear being available (a lot of race gear, but also some more freeride stuff), I have seen some new winDfoil riders at my spot (very few though).
The only problem is that most informations available on winDfoiling only talks of racy gear, and if not, there's a lot of 'not very good advises'.
Mario has found his niche and dropped a new one. Windfoiling is dead because we can all afford to holiday in Tarifa instead of the crappy lake 45 minutes from my house where I've foiled 6 hours this week with a 7.7 in conditions a fin couldn't touch.
Select to expand quote6u1d0 said..
Same problem : he says you need a big wide board, specific sail, expensive top end foil... and that is true for race winDfoil. But also this leads those who never tried winDfoil to think it's the only way : cumbersome, expensive, and for high end top riders. VS winGing that is still somewhat easier. No doubt this will keep winDfoil a niche sport.
...
The only problem is that most informations available on winDfoiling only talks of racy gear, and if not, there's a lot of 'not very good advises'.
Totally agree. Five yr old used gear still delivers a ton of fun. That's what I was using this week since my launch is kind of tricky and I'm not in the mood to destroy my good foil.
I like Mario videos but he recently helped Arnon with the development of a freerace fin board so.
I agree with Paducah: in the latest video, Mario is sailing in Tarifa 12-18mph wind. That happens in my spot so rarely that quitting windfoiling would drop my sailing time maybe 75%. where I sail (Seattle) windfoilers didn't go back to fin, they went to winging.
We all like Mario because he is... likeable, but in the end he's an influencer.
Just by way of illustration: I spent about a month in Sydney in March and with my 1 board 3 sail foil quiver I foiled every single day I went out to Botany when I thought there might be at least *some* wind. With an equivalent fin board & sails I'd have sailed less than half of the time and done less than a quarter of the km's.
That said, I'm eagerly looking forward to getting back on a fin slalom board soon but I'm not prepared to wait for suitable conditions to come along.
Sorry, but when you've had more years of experience than you have yet to do, reading, listening, and watching what influencers are offering makes me laugh (and cry).
The weather conditions, the spots, the environment, the social conditions, and the habits aren't the same across the globe.
This justifies such a varied offering and different ways of understanding sailing without a boat...
There are pros and cons to each specialty, and it's up to each of us to identify how happy we are when we get out on the water.
Price and quantity of materials, ease of transport, ease of use, reliability, access to basic information, the second-hand market, sharing with friends, and a thousand other things don't have the same priority for each of us.
Regarding the fin vs. windfoil debate, in the pre-foil era, I never saw anyone with fewer than 4-5 sails (with their respective masts and booms), 2-3 boards, and at least 6 fins.
If we're talking about costs in the racing world, it doesn't seem like there's a huge difference...
But even those who sail just for fun often turn up their noses when they're offered equipment that's only 2 or 3 seasons old...
I admire the efforts, expertise, determination, and mission of Nico, Mario, and Nils, but in recent months I've reconsidered my stance on what they publish.
Reputation is built through consistency...
For me, racing is racing BUT. I'm much more enthusiastic about sailing on fins than foil. My spot is just too shallow for Wind Foiling and they're rarely seen. Wing Foiling is much more accessible for us and the short run at the lower tides. So for me it's fin for wind, foil for a breeze and a surf foil for no wind. Interesting the gear increase isn't as bad as the old days with 1m wide boards and 9 mt sails, I've actually downsized to a van.
