Question for y'all. Has anyone played with bottom handle placement for windfoil?
On my last board I installed it just in front of the tracks, which seems typical. It worked fine, but it's so far aft of the CG that the nose wants to drag. I can lift it with the sail by sheeting in to send the sail towards the ground, the sails center is above the boom, so the boom is the fulcrum and therefore the UJ gets lifted. Counterintuitive and with a small unwanted down force but it's been working for me. Carrying the board unrigged by the handle is doable but would be easier if it was closer to the cg.
On an experimental board I moved the handle forward about 7.5 inches to get it close to the CG. That balanced the weight better, but I seem to remember hating it when rigged in the wind. I think what was happening was the setup stopped weather-vaning and just wanted to push me over. That was a couple years ago, and I didn't ride the board much, so my memory's a bit fuzzy. The weather-vaning is really important in the white water, it lines the board up with the wave and keeps the drag lower, so I want to keep that feature.
I'm getting close to laminating a new board and wondering whether to split the difference or just keep it just in front of the boxes. What do you think?
My Fanatic Stingray didn't have a bottom handle and since I ride strapless I needed something. So I put the foil on the board where I like it and carefully measured the balance point then put the handle there. It was pretty far in front of the foil tracks.
In contrast, my newer Duotone stingray does have a handle about 7 cm in front of the tracks and it's too far back and the nose wants to drop. If I had the CAD that wouldn't have happened.
Select to expand quoteBullroarerTook said..
My Fanatic Stingray didn't have a bottom handle and since I ride strapless I needed something. So I put the foil on the board where I like it and carefully measured the balance point then put the handle there. It was pretty far in front of the foil tracks.
In contrast, my newer Duotone stingray does have a handle about 7 cm in front of the tracks and it's too far back and the nose wants to drop. If I had the CAD that wouldn't have happened.
Thanks, mate! That's really useful. Do you usually carry with the tail into the wind or nose first, or do you switch to keep one end pointed into the main force like if the there is a strong side shore current or the waves if not lined up with the wind? I switch what end is in front of me to keep the tail into the biggest energy. Have you ever felt like the board is "sheeting in" and trying to push you over? It's got me thinking this behaves a lot like sailboat balance or rudder balance. If the balance point gets too close to the center of area, it starts to steer and overpower you. On the other hand if you grab the kit by the very end all you can do is point into the big force and will struggle to make any ground cross wind unless you crab walk, I'm starting to look more closely at handle placement relative to the deck's center of area across the boards I've tried or have data on.
With our launches it's usually nose first, but going in that's into the wind and coming out it's at my back. I rarely walk backwards unless the wind is really up.
Valid question. But it's just way better if the board is small/narrow enough that you wouldn't even need a handle, and could just pick up the gear and run to the water.
I've retrofitted lots of them, and it's easy in a finished board as we mount everything then find the balance point. Much harder to estimate before laminate
I normally find for that sort of handle it's 3-4" in front of the tracks so you'd be pretty close to it but I reckon go forward a bit
as an aside- have fun with the routing there, the top and bottom are different shapes. And they have the potential to leak so rough up and glass that bottom join beforehand
Select to expand quoteTaavi said..
Valid question. But it's just way better if the board is small/narrow enough that you wouldn't even need a handle, and could just pick up the gear and run to the water.
And same with the wing foil gear as well.
Tavi! You are absolutely right! I can and have used boards that size for fin. And foiling I had a 125l board that I could hip carry like in your video. Carrying is way easier with the smaller gear.
What can I say, I want the float. In the balance of the whole experience, I have more fun with the big boards I have built for myself. I know I can just grab the foil mast so that the handle is not needed. That hurts cause it's so skinny and plus you leave your sunblock on the mast wrecking the flow.
Thanks for what you do mate, particularly teaching windsurfing! Your videos are awsome!
Select to expand quoteMark _australia said..
I've retrofitted lots of them, and it's easy in a finished board as we mount everything then find the balance point. Much harder to estimate before laminate
I normally find for that sort of handle it's 3-4" in front of the tracks so you'd be pretty close to it but I reckon go forward a bit
as an aside- have fun with the routing there, the top and bottom are different shapes. And they have the potential to leak so rough up and glass that bottom join beforehand
Thanks Mark! I was hoping you would chime in.
I have been tracking CG on the boards I have built and have average distance aft of the center of buoyance that will get me pretty close. I can figure out how to get the weight to balance, my concern is the windage being too balanced because the handle is so far forward. I want to keep the auto weather-vaning. I need to find the sweet spot and figure out the method of predicting similar results in different design shapes. Any minute now I will pick a distance and get on with it, I have been waiting on materials to come in so I had a minute or two overthink things.
Yeah, that handle is "something". I noticed the shape difference, the big side is at the board bottom, and it is smaller inside the board. My plan is to cut square and let the gorilla glue fill the void.
Do you think it is worth it to taper the hole for weight and/or structure reasons?
I have owned but passed on this handle on three builds now because it looked like it would leak. This board I am building is XPS so a leak probably won't matter and with heavier foam I am looking for every weight saving opportunity I can. On the pro side for this handle, it is really light almost as light as the foam it will displace. The other pro, I can use something I bought years ago.
i router them out as the peanut shape, then take some of the narrow point (middle) away - so its halfway between the top and bottom shape - then it will go in on an angle. As yes its bigger at the top, but the bottom is wider at just the midpoint. This is what happens when you get idiots to design on CAD when they don't know the end use, and make it by the million in China 
