Ian Cairns.

> 10 years ago
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DavidJohn
DavidJohn
VIC
17570 posts
VIC, 17570 posts
12 Jun 2014 12:23am
Surfing legend now hooked on sup. Great interview.

Here.. http://stokeradio.com/2013/04/12/ian-cairns-on-the-standup-paddle-magazine-show/
DavidJohn
DavidJohn
VIC
17570 posts
VIC, 17570 posts
12 Jun 2014 9:22am
#t=96
husq2100
husq2100
QLD
2031 posts
QLD, 2031 posts
12 Jun 2014 11:03am
Legend!



Tang
Tang
VIC
580 posts
VIC, 580 posts
12 Jun 2014 1:17pm
How's that bottom turn at 1:20...?

I'm not sure I agree with the website blurb for the Stoke SUP bit though:

"We all know that SUP has the potential to blow up huge, but someone has to go out and make it happen. "

Exactly why does someone have to make SUP blow up huge? Surfing has blown up huge in general, with obvious problems with overcrowding and its impacts on all manner of things. I don;t know of anyone who's heard anyone else say "Geez, I wish a few more people would paddle out, the lineup's looking a bit bare today, I might be able to wait my turn for a set wave and not have to dodge anyone through the bowl section...".

This is not to say "new entrants" aren't welcome, as we're all pretty much new entrants in such a relatively young thing, but surely the issues confronting surfing, to which SUP is an active contributor, should be front and centre with promotion of SUP. If not, how crowded can the surf get before the experience is pushed past reasonable thresholds? I recognise the pursuit/sport/activity is going to grow, but I question the motives of those who would seek to make things grow for the sake of it. I can see history repeating itself and adding to the problems we're already experiencing.

Sorry to hijack things here, DJ - I might start this up separately. I better go stream the radio show over lunch.....it's also worth listening to the show when they had Dan Thomson on, too.

cheers
Antho
Antho
VIC
516 posts
VIC, 516 posts
12 Jun 2014 3:51pm
At least one Bronzed Aussie has seen the light!
teatrea
teatrea
QLD
4177 posts
QLD, 4177 posts
12 Jun 2014 3:56pm
Tang said...
How's that bottom turn at 1:20...?

I'm not sure I agree with the website blurb for the Stoke SUP bit though:

"We all know that SUP has the potential to blow up huge, but someone has to go out and make it happen. "

Exactly why does someone have to make SUP blow up huge? Surfing has blown up huge in general, with obvious problems with overcrowding and its impacts on all manner of things. I don;t know of anyone who's heard anyone else say "Geez, I wish a few more people would paddle out, the lineup's looking a bit bare today, I might be able to wait my turn for a set wave and not have to dodge anyone through the bowl section...".

This is not to say "new entrants" aren't welcome, as we're all pretty much new entrants in such a relatively young thing, but surely the issues confronting surfing, to which SUP is an active contributor, should be front and centre with promotion of SUP. If not, how crowded can the surf get before the experience is pushed past reasonable thresholds? I recognise the pursuit/sport/activity is going to grow, but I question the motives of those who would seek to make things grow for the sake of it. I can see history repeating itself and adding to the problems we're already experiencing.

Sorry to hijack things here, DJ - I might start this up separately. I better go stream the radio show over lunch.....it's also worth listening to the show when they had Dan Thomson on, too.

cheers


Great interview and I believe sup will eclipse surfing in participation numbers , not in the actual surf though. And yes the popular beaks are already overcrowded ,but a pecking order soon develops and when the surf gets a bit big the crowds soon disappear anyway. Much of it is herd mentality , their are plenty of spots to surf that are uncrowded just a stone throw or less from the popular breaks. This in my opinion is what makes sup so great. The only problem in surfing is surfers who weren't shown to share by Mummy and Daddy when they where grommets
DARTH
DARTH
WA
3028 posts
WA, 3028 posts
12 Jun 2014 4:22pm
Tang said...
How's that bottom turn at 1:20...?

I'm not sure I agree with the website blurb for the Stoke SUP bit though:

"We all know that SUP has the potential to blow up huge, but someone has to go out and make it happen. "

Exactly why does someone have to make SUP blow up huge? Surfing has blown up huge in general, with obvious problems with overcrowding and its impacts on all manner of things. I don;t know of anyone who's heard anyone else say "Geez, I wish a few more people would paddle out, the lineup's looking a bit bare today, I might be able to wait my turn for a set wave and not have to dodge anyone through the bowl section...".

This is not to say "new entrants" aren't welcome, as we're all pretty much new entrants in such a relatively young thing, but surely the issues confronting surfing, to which SUP is an active contributor, should be front and centre with promotion of SUP. If not, how crowded can the surf get before the experience is pushed past reasonable thresholds? I recognise the pursuit/sport/activity is going to grow, but I question the motives of those who would seek to make things grow for the sake of it. I can see history repeating itself and adding to the problems we're already experiencing.

Sorry to hijack things here, DJ - I might start this up separately. I better go stream the radio show over lunch.....it's also worth listening to the show when they had Dan Thomson on, too.

cheers


Get an inflatable SUP??
Tang
Tang
VIC
580 posts
VIC, 580 posts
12 Jun 2014 7:30pm
teatrea said...

Great interview and I believe sup will eclipse surfing in participation numbers , not in the actual surf though. And yes the popular beaks are already overcrowded ,but a pecking order soon develops and when the surf gets a bit big the crowds soon disappear anyway. Much of it is herd mentality , their are plenty of spots to surf that are uncrowded just a stone throw or less from the popular breaks. This in my opinion is what makes sup so great. The only problem in surfing is surfers who weren't shown to share by Mummy and Daddy when they where grommets


I see your point, Teatree, but I reckon there's more to it. Sharing is a major issue, to be sure, but after listening to the interview my original concerns would appear to be borne out.

I have no issue with blokes starig up a sup tour and enjoying competitive surfing, with people being introduced to it for its obvious fitness, stoke and outdoor elements, or with people making a living from it either competitively or through industry/business. However, Kanga's words give more than a hint of the motivations, IMHO. Both he and the announcer make it clear that "the plot is already laid out" for SUP when we can look to the evolution of surfing as a reference point for what is likely to happen. Fair enough, but surely they should also understand that the very high (stratospheric) growth in it that they forecast might also deliver problematic issues such as overcrowding and inexperienced people being out in lineups they're just not ready for.

Alas, there was no mention of the downsides, and I got the distinct impression that because Kanga is into it now, he has an appetite for doing to SUP what he did for surfing in the 80s in the US. That may be his prerogative, but I reckon these blokes need to take a deep breath and consider what their aspirations for the growth of the sport might mean for those of us who actually buy the gear from the industry which sponsors and supports the growth. They even suggest at one stage that it's going to go gangbusters and if you;re in business, you better hurry up and get in now. It just strikes me that in their pursuit of money/fame/lifestyle, whatever combo it is, they're quite happy to compromise the experience for the rest of us. A bit like the land developers selling the new estate with images of an uncrowded beach, all the while knowing that the extra people who buy into their PR will move in and mean its rarely uncrowded.

I got some comfort where he talks about so many old blokes taking it up and transferring from mals to SUPs, and with kids learning both SUP and surfing and transitioning between them. That might slow things up a little - but the kind of growth they're seemingly after reminds me of the kind of unsustainable growth we see in other aspects of society (housing, for example) where we kill the goose that lays the golden egg.

Like most issues, things can grow at a good pace or too quickly, and it pains me to hear people promoting what I consider to be the too quick option when the lessons should have been learnt a long time ago. There might be a lot of waves we can now surf on a SUP, but they're still finite in number, a bit like the other things that have been stuffed up by too many people or too much development. Sure, SUP will grow, but I reckon we should hurry slowly and do it intelligently.




sudsy
sudsy
VIC
78 posts
VIC, 78 posts
12 Jun 2014 10:16pm
Couldn't agree more Tang , spot on mate .
Teatree I don't know where you live mate but it must be awesome ,where i live used to be like that, now if it's any good ,there are no spots uncrowded [ a relative term anyway , for me its more than 10 on a peak ] and if its big and good evan more crowded .
While I agree that a big part of the problem is selfish people , as you point out. It' s by far not the only problem . I can only speak for the coast that I have lived on and surfed for the last 34 years and it has been ruined by overcrowding in the surf .Even if they were all nice guy's it's still the biggest problem in surfing . There is only one thing that ruins good surf and thats crowds .Yeah I know get over it it's never going to be like the old days and I'm cool with that , and I'm moving to a less crowded area .
Any one who ever thinks that more people surfing or supping is somehow good for surfing either has a vested interest or are deluding themselves .Surf reports and cameras have almost completely ruined Westernport bay and large parts of the west coast .
I guess if you think surfing with 20 30 40 50 guys all trying to scratch up the pecking oder is somehow ok, then you are probably higher up the pecking and wont understand where i'm coming from.
teatrea
teatrea
QLD
4177 posts
QLD, 4177 posts
12 Jun 2014 11:40pm
I live on possibly the most crowded spot in Aus. And surf one of the most crowded spots.To give a good example the said spot the other day was crowded so I paddled round to a beach break and had it to myself for 2hrs only 200m away their where 100 surfers ..waves where better too , go figure.I rekon their are uncrowded waves everywhere. Even when its crowded I still get my fair share of waves even if that means sharing one occassionaly! Anyway the more the merrier I say
surf4fun
surf4fun
WA
1313 posts
WA, 1313 posts
12 Jun 2014 10:57pm
I met Ian when he was over here for the Margaret's event and then spent a bit of time hanging out and chatting with him over at the ISA Worlds in Nicaragua, very cool and interesting guy.
John4F
John4F
116 posts
116 posts
12 Jun 2014 11:39pm
I cannot paddle due to a stiff back: my chin rests on the board while paddling as I can't lift my chest upwards.
SUP allows me to get into (SUP) surfing as I can bend my lower back forward.
Please consider this benefit for some people.
Tang
Tang
VIC
580 posts
VIC, 580 posts
13 Jun 2014 12:10pm
I don;t doubt Kanga is an interesting bloke, and I fully recognise the benefits of SUP for those with problems prone surfing - after all, I'm one of them thanks to my back. I would argue that those who can;t surf thanks to health issues are already on SUP or already moving that way, though, and that the future growth issue in that area has either already occurred or will occur through existing surfers transitioning through age/injury with no significant effect on crowds.

But the crowding issue is serious, and getting sillier. I surf a break here in town regularly, and everyone - old school and recent arrivals - are talking about not only how many more people are in the water, but that there are so many people in the water they have never even seen before. And I was on the phone last week with a few mates from up the coast where I'm originally from, a place where it used to be standard to try and catch up with people during the week or you were surfing on your own, who told me that on Easter Saturday there were 56 (!!!) blokes out at a place right off the beaten track. And not that long ago a crowd there would have been 10. I even remember one day a carload arrived from a town a few km further south than mine, and they waited for half an hour before even suiting up so as not to be rude even though it was pumping and 6 of us out. Can you imagine that now? I'm getting nostalgic....

Crowding in the surf is a bit like the fish we catch over generations. The fish your grandfather threw back are the ones your son now thinks are great. But when the kid hears about the fish the old man caught, he can;t help but think he's been dudded along the way, as grandad's regular fish are the trophy fish these days. I can;t figure out why, when there are so many examples of where things have been compromised, we would be foolish enough to repeat history's mistakes.

I just urge those who have the power to promote it to consider the integrity of the surfing experience when the blood is rushing as they look at the business opportunities or whatever it is that is driving their pursuit of growth. Greater numbers have an inevitable impact on the experience, and it doesn;t strike me as a particularly fair option for a select few to decide that there should be more people in the water and the experience lessened (for existing surfers and the new arrivals) as a result.
teatrea
teatrea
QLD
4177 posts
QLD, 4177 posts
13 Jun 2014 12:54pm
Cmon Tang you serious , people are attracted to the surf for the same reason you are. You going to try stop them because you got their first. A few people promoting the sport aren't going to convince the masses to take up sup surfing. The reality is people are becoming more aware of their health and fitness particularly the over 35 and what better sport to get into , its free to participate , its fun , and especially people who have had past injuries is relatively low impact so they can enjoy sports again. Problems arise in the surf because of attitude and poor communication that's all , I just cant believe you couldn't find a break to surf if you really wanted to surf without the crowds. Sorry mate but I think your way of the mark
Tang
Tang
VIC
580 posts
VIC, 580 posts
13 Jun 2014 4:25pm
Teatree, I'm certainly not advocating the lock-them-out approach and saying I was here first - not at all. My point is the rate of the growth, not the concept of growth, and that I don;t reckon it does anyone any good for SUP to grow like gang-busters - except of course those with some form of vested interest.

Coming from your crowded spot (Currumbin?) you'd know that no matter how polite the people, and no matter how good the communication, when there are too many people in the water (especially inexperienced people) you have to dodge them at the least. Education, good vibes, taking turns, it doesn;t deal with the fundamental issue of people in the way.

Yes, we can all get waves to ourselves if we try. I'm just not into surfing closeouts on a sup!

I suspect there's a bottle of red wine in this. Or two.
teatrea
teatrea
QLD
4177 posts
QLD, 4177 posts
13 Jun 2014 4:50pm
Yeah you have a fair point , but what do you do. A few wave poolsSurfing closeouts on a sup can be pretty fun though
Tang
Tang
VIC
580 posts
VIC, 580 posts
13 Jun 2014 8:25pm
The closeouts must be better in Queensland, that's all I can say......
boardbumps
boardbumps
NSW
698 posts
NSW, 698 posts
13 Jun 2014 11:11pm
Definitely warmer water, I love falling off when the water is 23C.
Come up laughing and thinking how good life is.
rodriguez
rodriguez
VIC
883 posts
VIC, 883 posts
14 Jun 2014 2:13pm
BASTARD
Tang
Tang
VIC
580 posts
VIC, 580 posts
14 Jun 2014 4:04pm
Ah, c'mon its a beautiful 15.6 degrees in the water down here at the moment. And who could argue with a balmy 12.2 on land at 230pm ( which "feels like" 6.7 degrees). At least now we're starting to get into crowd control weather!
teatrea
teatrea
QLD
4177 posts
QLD, 4177 posts
14 Jun 2014 7:07pm
Surfed one of the busiest spots in Aus today Tang. Had all the waves I wantedPeople look at a day like today as sloppy on shore crap , but on the right board it = fun. This is what sup brings to the table , you can virtually surf anything.
//
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">My Movie alley</a> from <a href="vimeo.com/user15623634">andrew edhouse</a> on <a href="vimeo.com">Vimeo</a>.
Tang
Tang
VIC
580 posts
VIC, 580 posts
14 Jun 2014 9:34pm
Totally agree with you on what sup brings to the table, teatree, and using the right board for the right conditions. Just not sure our definitions of "surfed" are the same though



teatrea
teatrea
QLD
4177 posts
QLD, 4177 posts
14 Jun 2014 10:48pm
Tang said...
Totally agree with you on what sup brings to the table, teatree, and using the right board for the right conditions. Just not sure our definitions of "surfed" are the same though





Its called straight line surfingpoint and shoot.Its pretty hard to turn a 14ft pintailThe chopper was flying low over me a few times , must have thought I was in trouble being the only idiot out in the mush
Tang
Tang
VIC
580 posts
VIC, 580 posts
15 Jun 2014 2:02pm
Savour those solo mush sessions I reckon. Almost as good as 3-4ft with 50 out......probably better.
Kami
Kami
1566 posts
1566 posts
16 Jun 2014 2:33pm
When surfers will get an under 7' SUP in their quiver, the trouble will be only crowd problem mixed with selfish experienced surfers and inexperienced people being out in lineups they're just not ready for whatever boards they are riding
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