Anyone tried down winding on a regular SUP like for instance a Naish Nalu 10'6" or 11'6"??
Does it work? Or is it much better on a 14' Race board?
What would be the best downwind boards available?
Cheers,
Ken.
It's almost impossible to catch a runner on a short board. You can stand, and paddle and get blown along but most of the time the waves will just surge past you.
I've done three runs now of about 5km distance downwind in 15-20 knots on my 11'4 Nalu. I'm 100Kg and under these wind conditions it is really hard to get a decent runner and I reckon 25+ knots would be required to give it any spice. My average speed, without getting all strenuous about it, was just over 8 knots, so you can cover the distance pretty quickly still.
One thing I've found is that it is possible to catch a bump, but then a swell will come through and slow you down prematurely. The wider nose is also a liability as once it goes under, any forward momentum just gets wiped straight off. On a longer board, you'd be able to keep your momentum going and try and link a few bumps together and it would be easier to release the nose.
As it turns out, it's predicted to be 25 knots tomorrow, so we'll see if that works any better 
, but in the meantime, I've ordered a new Naish Glide 14 footer as I reckon that'll be the right tool for the job. 
Another 11'4" Nalu DW experimenter here - goes ok, and fun, but would be much better on a purpose-sup imo.
I've done heaps of downwinders on 11'6" Nalu's.. 11'4" Nalu's.. and I wouldn't even consider using my 10'6" Nalu on a downwinder.. The others (11'6" and 11'4") went ok back then when I didn't know any better.. but a 12'6" race board or better still a 14' board is so so so much better the difference is like chalk and cheese.. The only Naish allround wave board shape that I'd consider using on a downwinder would be the 10'10" Nalu because of its channels would helps heaps to get it planing on a runner.. If you want a board for downwinders you need a 14' downwind board.. Something like the 14' Glide is perfect.. You just have to watch one of my DW vids to see how well this board performs on downwinders.. How heavy are you?
DJ
I was about to say my Nalu 11'4 keeps up with other boards just fine on downwinders. Just the other day I did a nice (15-20 knot) downwinder along with some good local riders on more appropriate boards and I could keep up with the others just fine. Really. Only the local pro SUP racer on a Fanatic falcon 14' x 25 was quicker than me. My Nalu seemed on par with a 12'6 Bark Laird for the bumps I was catching.
But! I guess I'm just blissfully ignorant (and was paddling like a #$&%*@#^&) . So I sure do look forward to scoring a faster board for my next downwinders.
Meanwhile... well... the ol' surfboard seems to do the trick. (and sure keeps me fit)
I am looking for a 12'6 board that is fast enough to race and stable and surfy enough to have a good time in chop and on downwinders. But that would be the subject of another thread. (Falcon 12'6 x 27.5?)
How heavy are you yugi?
Another factor I've considered is whether to run with just 1 or 3 fins. Three is theoretically more drag, but I found the board pretty twitchy with just 1 fin. I didn't notice any real speed difference with 1 versus 3.
Thoughts?
Hey Yugi.. I've always believed with SUP'ing that it's 90% the paddler (rather than the board) .. So I'm guessing if you're just as quick as people on 14' DW boards you're a much better paddler or working a lot harder than they are.. Also 15-20 knots is more a down wind direction paddle in a light wind.. Once the wind and waves increase the glide advantage on the longer boards becomes more obvious and also when the wind and waves pick up you start pearling more.. Pearling or just piercing slightly is a big part of downwinding and pearling around nose board sucks bigtime.. 12'6" boards work well as long as you're not a heavyweight because bigger people need bigger boards for downwinding IMO..
DJ
I did my first Dr race 4years ago on a 11'2 x 30 Starboard Blend. As the others have said it can be done but definitely a lot more fun on a race board.
75kg
Yes, DJ, I paddled hard to catch each bump and was on the ball to avoid pearling. I do know the board very well after 5 years on it.
We have pretty tight and steep waves here on the lake. Probably why a surfboard works.
I realize I need a more appropriate board. I had my eye on a used Fanatic Falcon 12'6 x 27.5 but a friend just called to announce he snagged it while I wasn't looking. Oh well, I just need to paddle hard a bit longer until I get a better weapon.
Select to expand quoteDavidJohn said..
I've done heaps of downwinders on 11'6" Nalu's.. 11'4" Nalu's.. and I wouldn't even consider using my 10'6" Nalu on a downwinder.. The others (11'6" and 11'4") went ok back then when I didn't know any better.. but a 12'6" race board or better still a 14' board is so so so much better the difference is like chalk and cheese.. The only Naish allround wave board shape that I'd consider using on a downwinder would be the 10'10" Nalu because of its channels would helps heaps to get it planing on a runner.. If you want a board for downwinders you need a 14' downwind board.. Something like the 14' Glide is perfect.. You just have to watch one of my DW vids to see how well this board performs on downwinders.. How heavy are you?
DJ
Thanks DJ,
I am 88 kg.
I have watched your DW vids, thanks.
I have actually bought a board for DW, as well as fitness paddling, not for racing.
Only had it for a week now, haven't done a downwinder on it, in fact have never done a downwinder.
But I am looking forward to it. The board is a 2011 Hobie 14 Elite.
The reason I posed the question about a regular type sup for DW, is that I am a long time surfer, including sups.
And when I took the Hobie into the Maroochy river mouth, (which was windy and choppy and a lot of water moving around), to try it at picking up some little runners, I found it much more difficult to manouvre and catch and surf them, than expected. Especially after watching the vid of Dogman on the 12 foot version of the same board easily catching and surfing, in the pocket, head high waves. Maybe the extra 2 foot makes a much bigger difference than I imagined?
So was wondering if I could have made a better choice in the type of board I bought?
Cheers,
Ken.
Hi Ken.. I know that board and paddle it a few times.. It's a great flat water boards for rivers and lakes especially if you're a big person.. You're not that big.. A friend bought one to do DW'ers with us.. Did one or two with us and sold it.. It sort of works but just gets a push along on runners.. Never seems to get planing or surfing on a runner.. So yes.. IMO you could have made a better choice.. The 12'6" Hobie's seem to work better but only if you're a lighter person.. If you want to be able to surf it and do downwinders there are much better boards out there now that will work better than your 14' Hobie.. IMO .. btw.. It's still a very nice flat water board.
DJ
Select to expand quoteyugi said..
75kg
Yes, DJ, I paddled hard to catch each bump and was on the ball to avoid pearling. I do know the board very well after 5 years on it.
We have pretty tight and steep waves here on the lake. Probably why a surfboard works. .
Part of my interest in this topic is that I was planning to get my son (70Kg) out on the 11'4 and me on the 14' hoping we'd both be able to downwind more or less matched. If I have the advantage over him, that's great - I'll just tell him that DJ reckons it's 90% due to the rider 
Where I am in northern NSW, the only real downwind options are open ocean and any winds that are more or less parallel to the coast are rarely perfectly aligned with the swell - so I think cross-chop, wave reflection off headlands, etc. makes it a bit more challenging.
Select to expand quoteGorgo said..
It's almost impossible to catch a runner on a short board. You can stand, and paddle and get blown along but most of the time the waves will just surge past you.
Just curious, why did I get a heap of red thumbs for that? I don't mind, or care, I just don't understand. What I said was true and basically the same as what everybody after me said.
If you want to do a downwinder and want to catch runners then you need a long board. 12' was the minimum for me to catch runners at 80kg. Even that length it was hard to get onto runners.
If you just want to stand and paddle and drift/get blown along you can do a downwinder on just about anything.
We did a downwinder with a mate's son on a NSP longboard (I think it was 11'). He was able to stand most of the time and cruise along. No runners were in any danger of being caught.
I used to do lots of downwinders on my 11'2". I think the only time we "caught" anything was in the last stretch where the wave stood up on a sand bar just before we crashed into the beach.
Select to expand quoteGorgo said..Just curious, why did I get a heap of red thumbs for that? I don't mind, or care, I just don't understand. What I said was true and basically the same as what everybody after me said.
Yeah that's a bit rough. It wasn't me but I'll give you a green.
Select to expand quoteGorgo said..Gorgo said..
It's almost impossible to catch a runner on a short board. You can stand, and paddle and get blown along but most of the time the waves will just surge past you.
Just curious, why did I get a heap of red thumbs for that? I don't mind, or care, I just don't understand. What I said was true and basically the same as what everybody after me said.
I wondered the same thing. My first board was a 12'6" surf shape and it couldn't catch anything I can't on the 9' board I have now.
Select to expand quoteKennyK said..DavidJohn said..
I've done heaps of downwinders on 11'6" Nalu's.. 11'4" Nalu's.. and I wouldn't even consider using my 10'6" Nalu on a downwinder.. The others (11'6" and 11'4") went ok back then when I didn't know any better.. but a 12'6" race board or better still a 14' board is so so so much better the difference is like chalk and cheese.. The only Naish allround wave board shape that I'd consider using on a downwinder would be the 10'10" Nalu because of its channels would helps heaps to get it planing on a runner.. If you want a board for downwinders you need a 14' downwind board.. Something like the 14' Glide is perfect.. You just have to watch one of my DW vids to see how well this board performs on downwinders.. How heavy are you?
DJ
Thanks DJ,
I am 88 kg.
I have watched your DW vids, thanks.
I have actually bought a board for DW, as well as fitness paddling, not for racing.
Only had it for a week now, haven't done a downwinder on it, in fact have never done a downwinder.
But I am looking forward to it. The board is a 2011 Hobie 14 Elite.
The reason I posed the question about a regular type sup for DW, is that I am a long time surfer, including sups.
And when I took the Hobie into the Maroochy river mouth, (which was windy and choppy and a lot of water moving around), to try it at picking up some little runners, I found it much more difficult to manouvre and catch and surf them, than expected. Especially after watching the vid of Dogman on the 12 foot version of the same board easily catching and surfing, in the pocket, head high waves. Maybe the extra 2 foot makes a much bigger difference than I imagined?
So was wondering if I could have made a better choice in the type of board I bought?
Cheers,
Ken.
hey Kenny,
this is that board.
Thanks Ryan,
That 12 foot starby, looks like it goes all right, manoeuvres pretty easy.
That's the "All Star" is it?
Ken.
Select to expand quoteDavidJohn said...
Great vid..
The Starbie [Race?] looks like it surfs well..
DJ
Haha, yeah the Starby is easier to surf, adding to that is that its a 12'6 and the Hobie is a 14. The rails on the Hobie I think allow it to surf better. Although the full nose of the Starby stops it nose diving I would definatly go the Hobie over the Starby if I was after a board just to surf the winter swells. Way better when it comes to trimming.
Downwinding the Starby would do laps around the Hobie.
As for the vid ill admit it, jonsey is a way better surfer than me. But I definatly had more fun
On the coast in a northerly even 10 knots and you get some good runs. In a southerly at least 15. Ideal is anything above
Select to expand quoteKennyK said..
What is the minimum, and the ideal wind strength for down winding, guys?
For us on the bay it's about 15-20 knots.. [starts getting really good around 25+]
Any less and it's just a flat water paddle with a slight breeze from behind.
DJ
....and then when it starts to gust to 40+ knots and you get blown onto runners without paddling (see DJ's 'Devil's Playground" vid), that's when the fun really starts.
Just keep in mind Kenny downwinders up here are nowhere near as tame as DJ's in the bay. If you did a moffs run in 40knots here you wouldn't come back! 40knots and you get rogue monsters breaking over nothing that would completely wipe you out!!
also we get swell bouncing back off the land adding to the difficulty of getting runs. Im constantly envious of DJ's downwinders
Never done the downwind stuff before but am about to get a Coreban Dart in the next few weeks. Luckily I live close to a large exposed lake to get started on.
.
We had one guy take 11'6 Nalu out in one of our 40knot + dwd races - he did over 12km/h ave speed - so if its' really really windy they do work - but diminishing returns when wind gets lighter...
Select to expand quoteRJK said..
Just keep in mind Kenny downwinders up here are nowhere near as tame as DJ's in the bay. If you did a moffs run in 40knots here you wouldn't come back! 40knots and you get rogue monsters breaking over nothing that would completely wipe you out!!
also we get swell bouncing back off the land adding to the difficulty of getting runs. Im constantly envious of DJ's downwinders
Maybe you could PM me if you are going on a DW'er, if you wouldn't mind taking me along?
Cheers,
Ken.
Select to expand quoteKennyK said..RJK said..
Just keep in mind Kenny downwinders up here are nowhere near as tame as DJ's in the bay. If you did a moffs run in 40knots here you wouldn't come back! 40knots and you get rogue monsters breaking over nothing that would completely wipe you out!!
also we get swell bouncing back off the land adding to the difficulty of getting runs. Im constantly envious of DJ's downwinders
Maybe you could PM me if you are going on a DW'er, if you wouldn't mind taking me along?
Cheers,
Ken.
sure thing, Saturday, meeting at cotton tree at 3pm. group run from arkwright to cotton tree. although it may be a little bit long for your first downwinder.
Select to expand quoteRJK said..KennyK said..RJK said..
Just keep in mind Kenny downwinders up here are nowhere near as tame as DJ's in the bay. If you did a moffs run in 40knots here you wouldn't come back! 40knots and you get rogue monsters breaking over nothing that would completely wipe you out!!
also we get swell bouncing back off the land adding to the difficulty of getting runs. Im constantly envious of DJ's downwinders
Maybe you could PM me if you are going on a DW'er, if you wouldn't mind taking me along?
Cheers,
Ken.
sure thing, Saturday, meeting at cotton tree at 3pm. group run from arkwright to cotton tree. although it may be a little bit long for your first downwinder.
That sounds ok to me. Thanks Ryan, I'll c u there.
I have been out in the river mouth practicing today at high tide. It was a bit too windy from the north to stay out there, 10 - 15 knots, the cross wind and chop making things very difficult. But I did get a couple of runners, getting a feel for it. The last one was the smallest but I went for the longest, toward the end of it there was practically nothing but I was still zooming along.
Cheers,
Ken.
