So. I have installed a monitor wind vane (I picked up for $500). I have been experimenting with it and it works well. I have been using a chain on the lead lines that sits in a notch in a stainless t bracket that came with the kit. I have just zip tied it to my tiller.
I see other people use cam cleats instead of the chain. I read people that swear by both methods.
I see the guys on free range sailing use cam cleats but I cannot find a video that looks at their setup in depth
before I drill holes in my tiller to either mount cam clears or the T spot bracket: what do those on this forum think works the best?
(note my lead line setup is temp as well. I'll install permanent ones in a better place soon and at a better angle)
I just use a 1/4" bolt vertically protruding through the tiller. The chain sits there by gravity. It mimics the pin you have on the aluminium bracket below the tiller. Perhaps the galvanised chain I use has shorter links than yours , but that's the only difference. If ever I don't like the bolt in the tiller, I could fill it with epoxy.
how on earth did you get a windvale for $500, i need advice on whether, one would work on my cheoy lee, was told its too heavy for the boat, and it will unbalance itself, not sure what too do,
Select to expand quoteilbft said..
..., one would work ....... was told its too heavy for the boat, and it will unbalance itself, not sure what too do,
It will work. Sometimes they come up on Gumtree Ebay and Facebook as has been linked on Seabreeze occasionally. Or you could make one from plans and/or magazine scans, or copy ideas from successful windvanes on smaller trailer sailers.
First of all well done on the purchase of an excellent system for a ridiculous price. I hope you feel guilty!
The chain set up is OK if your not overly concerned with steering accuracy. I expect my windvane self steering to be capable of out steering an Olympic helmsman at all times. I always have the control lines with a bit of tension and would also take out any movement in those turning blocks you have on the pushpit. On Ricochet [wheel steering] I have dinghy boom vang system in the control line to keep out any slop. The turning blocks mounted on the cockpit coaming 90 degrees to the pivot point on the tiller would be better.
The main advantage to using two jam cleats on the tiller is to be able to make slight adjustments to the weather helm allowance as the wind varies in strength. Most boats will have weather helm and most boats will have a slight increase in weather helm as the wind over the deck increases. Normally when you go to engage the windvane steering you will have the sails trimmed and you will be steering holding the tiller with the weather helm allowance there and the two lines are cleated off. If the wind increases the windward control line can be easily tightened slightly, might only be 5mm or so. Same as when the breeze eases. It is just a further refinement in tuning.
The video shows the cam cleats on Ramona with the Aries. Ricochet has wheel steering and I have the same Aries on her and fortunately I got the real Aries clutch system for the wheel. When making weather helm allowance adjustments I have to release the clutch momentarily and adjust the wheel and flick the clutch back in. The control lines stay taunt the whole time.
Hi jbarnes
If you want to fit cam cleats to the tiller but don't want to drill holes you can make a clamp pretty easily.
In this vid at about 3:30 I show what I made up to do the job.
gary
Be sure to mount the control line's to the tiller where they will give you a decent amount of rudder swing.
Too far forward on the tiller and all that movement and energy from the servo oar will be wasted. Also check at what angle the control lines attach to the tiller so they give you maximum travel advantage.
Great thanks. I think I'll try the cam cleats but might knock up something to temporarily attach to the tiller before I commit to drilling holes. Think I'll them on seperate pieces of ply then lash them to the tiller.
I have a tiller clutch which I had thought about trying to use but it's too far forward and I also haven't come up with a way to use it for the wind vane then also be able to use it for its purpose which I like to do when coming into the berth. yeh I saw it posted on FB a year ago and I jumped at it.
The distance up the tiller from the rudder post for the attachment point is critical to get the correct ratio. This should be available on the Monitor webpage. Yours looks about right. On Ramona there is a SS ring there and the lines turn there and run out to the camcleats out near the end of the tiller. Just make up a clamp from timber or chopping board plastic and experiment.
Rig the course setting lines so that you can make adjustments from the cabin or from your normal seating position in the cockpit.
Select to expand quoteJolene said..
Thanks. That's actually super helpful as I still need to mount the blocks in a permanent location.
Select to expand quoteRamona said..
First of all well done on the purchase of an excellent system for a ridiculous price. I hope you feel guilty!
The chain set up is OK if your not overly concerned with steering accuracy. I expect my windvane self steering to be capable of out steering an Olympic helmsman at all times. I always have the control lines with a bit of tension and would also take out any movement in those turning blocks you have on the pushpit. On Ricochet [wheel steering] I have dinghy boom vang system in the control line to keep out any slop. The turning blocks mounted on the cockpit coaming 90 degrees to the pivot point on the tiller would be better.
The main advantage to using two jam cleats on the tiller is to be able to make slight adjustments to the weather helm allowance as the wind varies in strength. Most boats will have weather helm and most boats will have a slight increase in weather helm as the wind over the deck increases. Normally when you go to engage the windvane steering you will have the sails trimmed and you will be steering holding the tiller with the weather helm allowance there and the two lines are cleated off. If the wind increases the windward control line can be easily tightened slightly, might only be 5mm or so. Same as when the breeze eases. It is just a further refinement in tuning.
The video shows the cam cleats on Ramona with the Aries. Ricochet has wheel steering and I have the same Aries on her and fortunately I got the real Aries clutch system for the wheel. When making weather helm allowance adjustments I have to release the clutch momentarily and adjust the wheel and flick the clutch back in. The control lines stay taunt the whole time.
Hi Romona, I love this video. There is so much joy for me watching it work here.
Select to expand quotejbarnes85 said..Jolene said..
Thanks. That's actually super helpful as I still need to mount the blocks in a permanent location.
I use a couple of closed CLAM cleats as the primary attachment to the tiller. I then have a couple of CAM cleats further down the tiller towards the rudder to tail the lines. This gives me a secure attachment and keeps the forward portion of the tiller clean so it doesn't bruise and remove skin as you sweep the tiller into the crews legs.
Select to expand quoteBundeenabuoy said..Ramona said..
Hi Romona, I love this video. There is so much joy for me watching it work here.
The only downside to using Windvane self steering gear is not being able to stop watching it! I often find myself glancing up at it while reading in the cockpit and even down in the cabin I will stand and stare at it for ages.
Select to expand quoteJolene said..
Don't want to be a pest but that loading on those clamcleats is not any of the load cases they are designed for, as far as I am aware.
Surprisingly no-one seems to give a load rating on clamcleats
www.ronstan.com.au/marine5/clamcleats.asp
The clamcleat site has marine and industrial application folders, including for use in ladder safety. I couldn't find any load ratings but might be missing something. Which brings the question why are they allowed to be used in any application if there is no load rating?
www.clamcleat.com/lateral-port.html
Harken gear has load ratings.
www.harkenindustrial.com/en/harkenindustrialcom/purchase-systems-39/ce-41-purchase-system/
Select to expand quoteJolene said..
The cam cleats your going to adjust need to be about 100mm from the end of the tiller {where you hold}. A SS ring bolted through the tiller at the pivot point where you have the jam cleats is the way to go.
This is a video from a few years ago of Ramona with my home made version of a Monitor. The ratios and dimensions are identical to a Monitor the only real difference is the rubber belt for course setting where the Monitor uses a SS chain. There were a lot of changes made after this video was made, particularly to the tiller that is SS rod in the video was later changed to SS tube to handle the generated power. There is **** loads of power on the tiller by the time you get to about 5 knots!
About minute1.30 you can see the tiller control lines and the camcleats. There are actually 3 turning points. The normal one is at minute 1.32 and this was used 90% of the time. If I was planning on sailing close hauled for a long period I would use the ring just in front of the cleats. This gives a slightly slower response. Down closer to the rudder post is another ring that I used sailing dead down wind on light days. When there is a bit of slop I found I needed a fast response to steer right. This short setting gives a very rapid response but also has less leverage. When the breeze was 10 knots over the deck I always used the centre ring.
Select to expand quoteRamona said..Jolene said..
The cam cleats your going to adjust need to be about 100mm from the end of the tiller {where you hold}. A SS ring bolted through the tiller at the pivot point where you have the jam cleats is the way to go.
Why,, my wind vane works just fine and I don't want protrusions where I hold the tiller
Select to expand quoteJolene said..Ramona said..Jolene said..
The cam cleats your going to adjust need to be about 100mm from the end of the tiller {where you hold}. A SS ring bolted through the tiller at the pivot point where you have the jam cleats is the way to go.
Why,, my wind vane works just fine and I don't want protrusions where I hold the tiller
Not where you hold the tiller. Leave a double hand hold distance on the end of the tiller. It's best to have all the adjustments easy to reach from your normal seated position in the cockpit.
