How concerned should I be about the amount of rust showing around the seating of the forward and aft keel bolts. The 4 central ones look good.
There had been water sitting in the bilge for some time. The flooring is one single sheet so quite an effort to lift up.
What remedial action should be taken?
Thanks for advice.
Sorry to say but that doesn't look good. What model yacht is it?
The reason that the 4 central ones are suggested to "look good" in the post is that they seem to have smaller outside diameter round washers than the 4 central ones which have larger diameter round and larger size square washers. The It is probable that the rust under these inner 4 keel bolt washers is similar to the 2 outer ones - the integrity of the bolts would be unknown. Also the 2 outer single bolt washers have a lot more corrosion on them than the 4 central - they may be a lower grade stainless material such as 304 not 316 which can rust faster.
What does this mean "The flooring is one single sheet so quite an effort to lift up". The hull floor in way of the keel bolts looks like a suitably thickened laminate and won't just "lift up". Keel bolt renewal would need slipping and completely detaching the keel and re-newing all the keel bolts if that is possible.
Remedial action advice is not possible until more information is in - yacht model, keel material cast iron or lead, keel bolt arrangement (j bolts in keel, threaded down into keel, or keel flange with csunk bolts.
Select to expand quote
What does this mean "The flooring is one single sheet so quite an effort to lift up". The hull floor in way of the keel bolts looks like a suitably thickened laminate and won't just "lift up".
I'm thinking that the OP means the cabin floor is one piece of ply, not sectioned up(?) over the separate bilge areas.
Note that the rusty ones are screws, and the others are nuts on j bolts or similar. The washers on the screws look like they are corroding. As screws you could try unscrewing next time you have the boat on the slip. I am guessing the washers were just simple gal ones, and need replacing.
Boat is a Santana 22.
Booked for haul out and anti foul next week, so I will talk to them about the bolts.
Yes cabin floor is a single sheet, so quite fidly to get up.
Checking online suggests that keel is cast iron and that original bolts were galvanised, however ours are definitely stainless. The bolts/ screws themselves look ok, however the surrounds or seats look much more iffy.
Select to expand quoteSkipper58 said..
Boat is a Santana 22.
Booked for haul out and anti foul next week, so I will talk to them about the bolts.
Yes cabin floor is a single sheet, so quite fidly to get up.
Checking online suggests that keel is cast iron and that original bolts were galvanised, however ours are definitely stainless. The bolts/ screws themselves look ok, however the surrounds or seats look much more iffy.
Easy then just new bolts if tapped into the keel fin
Had 2 Santana 22s but that was a while back, remember the arrangement now. Strong boat. If you have the normal keel arrangement it is a cast iron flanged keel with csunk bolts as per here so "reasonably easy" to renew the keel bolts on the slips. You probably have these links - there are numerous other good ones on S22 restorations.
www.jamesdilworth.com/archive/boat/haulout.php
www.cruisersforum.com/forums/f47/santana-22-overhaul-where-do-i-start-73432.html
forums.iboats.com/threads/what-to-do-about-a-deteriorating-keel.611904/
Wouldn't think you would need to touch the grp of the hull keel floor laminate just clean it up properly so the new holes can be suitably sealed as well as the keel flange top surface and perimeter edges to the hull underside.
If renewing the bolts - strongly suggest getting Bumax Grade 8.8 316 stainless bolts and matching strength washers and nuts from stainlesscentral not 304 or lowest strength grade 316 stainless. Use all large square washers inside for them all like 2 of the central ones.
www.stainlesscentral.com.au/
Thank you for those links. They make really good reading. Looking at the pics, their keel bolts are in really bad condition.
All 6 of mine are shiny steel with no rust. The only issue seems to be what might have been the washers around the front and back ones. Possibly not the same grade of stainless. I very much doubt that the keel is going to fall off, but it could be a point of water ingress if breaking down so will get it checked when on the hard.
No problem good that the links were of use. Apologies I didn't have time this morning to include the fact that the originally built in the US S22s had galvanised steel keel bolts and nuts / washers which is what you have observed in the links - so totally inappropriate. The Aust built boats (by Gordon Woods a top boat builder) used stainless keel bolts and nuts/washers as far as I know - not sure what grade.
Have saved your photos and zoomed right into the front and rear single fasteners and it sure looks like the washers of those 2 are probably galv steel as per Yara so should never have been fitted. It is not clear however if those 2 fasteners are hex screws or csunk bolts - why are they the only 2 fasteners with filler glue on their top? I would conclude that they are both csunk ss bolts and nuts like the other 4 but the length of the bolts wasn't sufficient for the bolt end to protrude out past the end of the nut as it should have - at least 2 threads out past - so someone has put a bit of glue on top to fill the hole and hide the evidence.........suggest you confirm this next time on board by popping the glue off. It is probably no big deal if they are a bit short - say 1/2 or 1 thread. Please advise?
So when you are on the hard for sure suggest you at least replace those 2 washers and sort out all potential keel to hull sealing issues around the whole perimeter of the keel flange. I had to do this during the slipping of both S22s I owned and it is probable that you will find loose sealant etc. Dig out carefully without damaging the cast iron or keel bolts, seal with 3M5200. Google for the best way to use 5200 and cast iron primer in this process. Be very careful about undoing the ss nuts off the keel bolts to change the 2 washers and also maybe doing the same for the central 4 to inspect the bolts. Stainless fasteners have a very bad thread galling potential see 2nd link below. See 3rd link below for good general article for keel bolt maintenance when slipped. To potentially avoid thread galling spray CorrosionX on the end of the bolt and nut a few times before you slip - hopefully it will penetrate suitably and avoid thread stripping when you undo the nut. Obviously if you thread strip this is dire for a keel bolt but on the slip with csunk flange bolts it is easily recoverable.
www.whitworths.com.au/corrosionx-lubricant-170g
www.anzor.com.au/blog/what-is-stainless-galling
www.j24.com.au/keel-bolt-maintenance-bulletin/
Update: Bolts inspected while getting anti fouled. The front and back ones are indeed nuts on a shorter bolt.
Yard did remove both nuts, one at a time and replaced stainless washer under. Both showed little evidence of washer, just metal debris.
