The answer is YES, it worked well on long tacks as I needed to drag it to windward of the centre line of the yacht. It probably gave the yacht an extra 1-2 deg. upwind.
In short course races it was left to the centre point.

'Centre sheeting' v 'end of boom sheeting' also has an effect of boom angle, end sheeting gets the boom closer to the centre line of the yacht... But you need to deal with a lot more sheet rope. End sheeting also works well with run / push starts.
Centre sheeting seems to be the most used these days.

I have a hunch that a traveler may help one to gain a few degrees downwind as well based off sailing my solid wing rigs.

Nikrum said...
OK! So I will ask the question.. What is a Traveler and if anyone says some one going from point A to point B or a Gipsy etc. I am going to come to and annihilate them. OK??
Ron

Ron a 'traveler' is a track set up that goes across ways across the yacht, the main sheet pulley is attached to the traveler so the rig can be sheeted in and pulled in tight yet is still able to move across the yacht. By doing this it reduces the twist in the rig and makes the sail work more efficiently.
Most water yacht have them to de-power the rig yet still have a stable rig, they do this by letting the traveler off....

On a land yacht I have used the one in the pic to move the bottom main sheet pulley 'upwind' of the centre line of the yacht, what this does is pull the boom slightly to windward making the yacht point very slightly up higher into the wind. Over a very long course it might give you an extra degree or so which might mean you might not have to do a tack where your opposition might, which gets you to the turning marker sooner.



Use it properly it gives a very slight advantage, (but there are more things to adjust and keep under control). Leave it centre and you are equal to other yachts around you, or use it wrongly and you won't point as high into the wind and you be at the rear of the fleet on the track.
Travelers only tend to work for upwind sailing and have very little effect down wind sailing for land yachts.

have often contemplated using a traveler system with the uncut windsurfer sail and standard wishbone boom setup to get rig closer to center or past., feel there is tons of performance to be found without having to modify anything. from what i have read an iceflyer acheives very significant speed but may not point as high as a cl5 or mini. might this be overcome with a simple traveler system, yes? recently there have been statements about landyachts applying significantly more downhaul than a standard windsurfer setup, could someone explain how that is possible? most ws sail modifications take some luff curve out suggesting less downhaul is applied to set shape with mast. is the modded sail fuller than a properly downhauled, outhauled standard windsurfer sail?

Those are my thoughts as well OM, Seems to me that Wind Surfers have a hell of a lot more curvature in their masts and can bust then easily in hot weather.. So how the hell would they survive out on Salt Flats and Deserts??

Ron

landyacht said...

I have to disagree with the downwind bit gizmo, when sailing fast downwind it is always too easy to be oversheeted, which we do to control the twist( not having a vang). having a traveller enables you to set the sheeting tight ,but eased off to leeward. it can be very effective in stronger winds ,if your rig isnt one that lays off at the top,

Was that with a class5 and was it centre or rear sheeted? I would have thought that tacking fast down wind you would not have time to make the necessary adjustments.
How long was the traveler and do you still use them on your yachts?

Gizmo said...

landyacht said...

I have to disagree with the downwind bit gizmo, when sailing fast downwind it is always too easy to be oversheeted, which we do to control the twist( not having a vang). having a traveller enables you to set the sheeting tight ,but eased off to leeward. it can be very effective in stronger winds ,if your rig isnt one that lays off at the top,

Was that with a class5 and was it centre or rear sheeted? I would have thought that tacking fast down wind you would not have time to make the necessary adjustments.
How long was the traveler and do you still use them on your yachts?

havent had time to even think about one on a mini, but just starting to play with the 5.
removing the rowlock from the boom suddenlygives you all sorts of new possibilities and issues to work with(finally Im starting to get it)
finally having a rig /wheel.chassis set up where I can cleat the sheeting ,give you time to fiddle and tweek

The discussion on sailboards sails now has its own thread...
www.seabreeze.com.au/forums/Land-Yacht-Sailing/Sail-making/Sailboard-Sails/

Most travelers I've seen have a purchase system on them . This one doesn't appear to have one. Is it hard to pull to windward when sheeted in?

Gizmo said...

Nikrum said...
OK! So I will ask the question.. What is a Traveler and if anyone says some one going from point A to point B or a Gipsy etc. I am going to come to and annihilate them. OK??
Ron

Ron a 'traveler' is a track set up that goes across ways across the yacht, the main sheet pulley is attached to the traveler so the rig can be sheeted in and pulled in tight yet is still able to move across the yacht. By doing this it reduces the twist in the rig and makes the sail work more efficiently.
Most water yacht have them to de-power the rig yet still have a stable rig, they do this by letting the traveler off....

On a land yacht I have used the one in the pic to move the bottom main sheet pulley 'upwind' of the centre line of the yacht, what this does is pull the boom slightly to windward making the yacht point very slightly up higher into the wind. Over a very long course it might give you an extra degree or so which might mean you might not have to do a tack where your opposition might, which gets you to the turning marker sooner.



Use it properly it gives a very slight advantage, (but there are more things to adjust and keep under control). Leave it centre and you are equal to other yachts around you, or use it wrongly and you won't point as high into the wind and you be at the rear of the fleet on the track.
Travelers only tend to work for upwind sailing and have very little effect down wind sailing for land yachts.

US772 said...
Most travelers I've seen have a purchase system on them . This one doesn't appear to have one. Is it hard to pull to windward when sheeted in?

The set up in the pic had a 2:1 ratio purchase system on it, the 2 ropes that controlled it had a knob the size of a golf ball on the ends to get a good grip on.
As you laid down the maximum pull length was exactly 1 arm length from the cleat.
In light to med winds it was OK to drag across but in strong winds it was virtually impossible to move it to windward, it was then just left in the centre position.
The pulley thing (clump) comprised of 4 pulleys, 1x was the bottom main sheet pulley, below that was another pulley at 90deg to the main sheet pulley that ran on a 12mm steel shaft (traveler) and there were 2x small pulleys, one each side for the purchase systems all joined together with one shackle.

US772 said...
Did you use the full length of the traveler?

Most times it was left central and was only used on long upwind legs in light / med winds. If you were doing lots of tacking it would be a disadvantage.
Unlike water yachts I found using the using the traveler in a + direction (to windward) workable, most water yachts use travelers in a - direction (to leeward) which is easier to set up the traveler stops just to limit the maximum / outer limits.
So normally centre OR full left OR full right, as the traveler was actually quite short 300-400mm fiddly adjustment wasn't warranted.

US772 said...

Has anyone had a traveler on a 5 sm or mini?

So to the original question... Yes. This then leads to the next question "are travelers on a land yacht worth the effort?" Im my personal belief...NO

Yep could do that... But in those wind speeds you would just be hanging on for dear life the traveler would be the last thing you would be interested in. Pinching a bit higher into wind would be easier.
I'm also assuming the course you would be sailing would have legs no longer than 1km, very long course legs where you have time to adjust and play might be ok.
When you tack or Jybe with a traveler it wacks over real hard in strong winds, and if it was in a centre sheet system you could be singing saprano easily....