I have the templates cut out and the side frame jig done. I cut out parts for a boat and made the side frames this week.

Great job! What about the weight of this wooden wonder?

I have no idea what to expect for weight. The nice thing about the mini is the lack of sail size restriction. If you are heavy or light the sail size can be suited to accommodate.

Clemco said...

US772 said...
I have no idea what to expect for weight. The nice thing about the mini is the lack of sail size restriction. If you are heavy or light the sail size can be suited to accommodate.

In that case you are always better off being heavy ?

Not really because a bigger sail does not equate to more speed unless of course you sail in a cyclone

I am really looking forward to following progress on this mini, it is nice to see something a bit different.

Regarding the sail size / weight thing, might it make a difference that minis often seem to race on very short courses (I see that slalom has made an appearance in Ireland)? What is the importance of top end speed vs. acceleration out of turns?

I disagree as to the momentum advantage as when wind speed drops the heavier pilot/yacht slows down and the lighter pilot/yacht keeps on going. The greater weight increases friction on bearings and tyres and therefore slows you down more than a lesser weight. This I know from experience(115kg) plus yacht!
If the desert was of soft sand, lighter means yacht does not sink so far and has less rolling resistance which has to be overcome before you can start using apparent wind. This I learnt on the beach at Rada Tilly Argentina racing Promo Class Worlds a couple years ago

TP1, Us light guys also slow down just as fast if we sail into soft sand. Probably not much chance of that at Smith Creek which is I assume is where US772 is designing this yacht for.
Compare the AC45 cats to the mono-hull AC boats. The cat is built super light but has leverage on the sail by way of its width. Similar to US772's Wingnut boat. The mono-hull boats have stuff all width for leverage so they have to hang a ton of weight under it to hold it upright. The mini landyacht is similar to the mono-hull. Your leverage is barely half a metre on the rig so your only option is to use weight.
By the way I hear the guy that won the Fisly C5 at Rada Tilly was a 100+kg bloke on a heavy Yorker OTT and the super light weight French yachts got hammered in the gusts. How do you figure that?
I guess TP1 we will have to agree to disagree.

Clemco said...
TP1, Us light guys also slow down just as fast if we sail into soft sand. Probably not much chance of that at Smith Creek which is I assume is where US772 is designing this yacht for.
Compare the AC45 cats to the mono-hull AC boats. The cat is built super light but has leverage on the sail by way of its width. Similar to US772's Wingnut boat. The mono-hull boats have stuff all width for leverage so they have to hang a ton of weight under it to hold it upright. The mini landyacht is similar to the mono-hull. Your leverage is barely half a metre on the rig so your only option is to use weight.
By the way I hear the guy that won the Fisly C5 at Rada Tilly was a 100+kg bloke on a heavy Yorker OTT and the super light weight French yachts got hammered in the gusts. How do you figure that?
I guess TP1 we will have to agree to disagree.

rada tilly was a fascinating place to watch class 5 yachts racing. the heavy pilots dominated class 5 sportiv,and the light pilots dominated promo. .
I believe what was happening was that the heavier pilots in the sportiv were able to lay still and force the yacht to flex,whereas in the promo yo needed to throuw you weight around. when building my minis i use the principle of stiff yacht has a flexible rig and a flexible yacht(y frame ,plank axle or OTT is able to support a stiffer rig.
when yachts at rada tilly started lifting wheels in the gusts , both types of 5 lifted at the same time ,the promos gradually(softer rig) and the sportiv verysuddenly(stiffer Rig).
I have also noticed that sails I have that are cut for Stiff European masts, dont sit well on my Stiff australian mast. I had to fit the Euro sails to a softer mast or evn recut the luff to suit the mast.
looking at the wood construction of this yacht I think as ling ast the link betwwen the mast base and the axle mount is well beefed up a stiff rig could be used as all the work will be done by the nice flexible rear wooden axle. 3/4" thick plank would be ideal, any thicker i suspect will leave the back too stiff.
of course I dont have a peice of his wood to compare, but a few years ago I was allowed to use a piece of american ash to compare with aussie woods and it was pretty much comparable with "tassie oak" which is what I use

Momentum will only come into play if the wind suddenly stops. If the wind speed drops then the lighter units will have the advantage

US772 said...
Based off what we have experienced in the bigger boats a light weight boat doesn't seem to be any advantage on the drylake beds we sail unless its blowing below 12 or so.
Light = good acceleration off the line and to repower in a tack.
Heavier = better righting moment, traction, momentum. For me personally I will push a boat harder if I feel safer in it. My hope is the extra weigh will be off set by a higher top end due to better aerodynamics. I'm not sure how the mini will be run as far as course length at Smith Creek. The longer the course and race time the more the aero will play into it

keep in mind that the mini comps held so far have featured short sharp races,and a heavy yacht may be just winding up as the lighter boats are rounding the mark and accelerating away downwind

I'm making the boat primarily for Smith Creek and for an iceboat. We usually do timed races. 15 minutes is about the shortest race they ever run. With the manta singles that they race here (comparable to a mini) they go to a closer mark than the bigger boats. I don't see anything less than 1 mile apart on a windward leeward race. I think the race committee would have an easier time counting sail numbers with longer lap times than short lap times.


I've had more than one person say hey that thing looks like a bob sled. Funny how your boat gets named for you sometimes by others.

Clemco said...
The boat looks great! love it. You may get a shock how tippy these minis are especially at low speed. At high speed it's a bit like riding a bike. If you time it right at the rolling starts you will have no problem getting to the top mark first. I imagine the US will make the most of the desert space and set a relatively big coarse compared to our beaches where we sometimes have to do a complete U turn within a 30 metre width at 80k or end up in the ocean. Unheard of in the desert.