It turns into a depowered 8m!

Not a 7 or a 6.

^^^All of the above. ^^^. Unless your centre lines are stretched they don't fly well fully depowered; especially in gusty conditions. One of the characteristics of wave kites is they can shut the power fully off with minimum throw. I only ever like to use centre rigging knot on bridal and if I have to pull on full depower it's the wrong size kite. Direction of wind also comes into play, as to how well you handle being overpowered. 30kn is perfect 6m weather

IanR said..

pearl said..
One of the characteristics of wave kites is they can shut the power fully off with minimum throw.

I agree 100% with every thing else you say

But it is my experience that is a characteristic of all short bridle pulleyless kites.

trll us again how great pulleys are!

To get back on topic. You wont get 6m performance by pulling the trim strap on an 8m. You can easily ride an 8m reo in 30 knots. But you will be powered and jumping not riding waves down the line very well.

So.... change your style to powered 8m 30 knot riding or go in rig a 6m and keep riding your surf style riding.

Just wanted to repeat, that "depowering" or trimming your kite does not make it smaller (or larger). Depower is a really poor choice of word to describe what we do when we pull in our let out the TRIM strap/rope.

When the wind is strong for the kite size you have chosen, or if the wind increases while you are kiting, you find that you are unable to keep the bar pulled in to a comfortable riding position, you end up in "pooman" stance. By shortening the front lines or trimming you effectively make the rear lines longer by the same amount and this allows you to ride again in a comfortable position.

So you can see that the term depowering is extremely misleading, as the action of shortening your front lines does not depower the kite, the power from the kite remains exactly the same, but its available to the rider now further towards them on the centre line.
The downside is that some kites, actually quite a lot have excessively long trim lines and they can make the rear lines to loose that the kite can hardly be steered or ridden and handles like a pig.

And then there is the trim system used by the top foil racers, that have up to 4-5 times normal trim length, because they can travel so fast that the kite is getting almost all of its power from the apparent wind. They trim in massively when pointing high upwind, and then when they got the point of tacking the release the front lines (make them longer) to keep the kite stable and to have the ability to steer it through the tack and then trim it again once they pick up speed, upwind, on the new tack. When they are flying downwind, they let all the trim out and keep the kite well "powered" and even a bit over trimmed.

Sorry for "reviving" the topic. As far I know the best method to reduce the power would be having a second bar with shorter lines. 4m shorter there's significant less power and a more direct response at same time. Btw I have basically all REOs. 8m is wonderful but the 5m is NOT a good kite.

IanR said..

mariokiter said..
Sorry for "reviving" the topic. As far I know the best method to reduce the power would be having a second bar with shorter lines. 4m shorter there's significant less power and a more direct response at same time. Btw I have basically all REOs. 8m is wonderful but the 5m is NOT a good kite.

Unfortunately Mario that is not the case.
If you are being over powered by a kite parked at the edge of the window, reducing the line lenght will not make an difference
What you are doing by reducing the line lenght is making the window smaller and reducing the amount of time it takes for the kite to fly across the window. In other words the power the kite produces is the same it just finishes quicker because the kite has less distance to travel to get the edge of the window.
The only solution for an overpowered kite is to put up a smaller kite

i dont think only solution is to put up a smaller kite, what about smaller board you can edge hard, at least you won't be wasting time pumping another kite and regretting, and when its 30kts gusting wind speed can change so much more or less compared to forecast having the same kite makes more sense. plus I'd ditch the conventional wisdom of going short lines in high winds and go with longer lines but smaller kite - if a squall (?) its its better parked smaller kite

McTool

The board you ride makes no difference to bar feel
The Cab Drifter has a pulley/slider in its bridle system.
www.cabrinha.com/collections/kites/products/drifter

The only explanation is you are a Ozone kite Pimp, and biased.
People like different things, you like kites that have an on/off feel, I don't
Niether is right or wrong

PS as KA NSW representive to KA could you explain why there has been no notice of the AGM for 2 years
www.kiteboardingnsw.org.au/category/news-events/

IanR said..
McTool

The board you ride makes no difference to bar feel
The Cab Drifter has a pulley/slider in its bridle system.
www.cabrinha.com/collections/kites/products/drifter

The only explanation is you are a Ozone kite Pimp, and biased.
People like different things, you like kites that have an on/off feel, I don't
Niether is right or wrong

PS as KA NSW representive to KA could you explain why there has been no notice of the AGM for 2 years
www.kiteboardingnsw.org.au/category/news-events/

Ian

The board you ride makes no difference to bar feel

Thats just silly and shows your lack of knowledge about actually riding surfboards in waves.

Another explantion is that you are angry with me, and therefore have a hate plan on fire for Ozone.

I actually said that I've ridden several other wave kites, they all do the job, lots of people like them. All have short bridles, most have a longer throw/on/off than a Reo. I prefer a Reo, as Pearl said you can just shut it down and ride the wave, and bring back the power when needed. Its not a feel thing (which is perhaps something in your mind) its an actual need, when riding waves you need to be able to shut off the pull quickly and get it back just as quickly.
You don't like that "feel", but you don't ride surfboards in waves, and you definitely have not ridden ALL wave kites, so you opinion is......?

This is a fun read.

When it's nuking and I've got too big a kite, I just pump it up to the next size down number of pumps.

So 10m = 55 pumps and 8m = 45. If I want my 10m to be an 8m, I just pump up the 10m with 45 pumps. Then it doesn't expand as much and flys like an 8m. This is a really good way to get in-between sizes.

It also works in reverse, if I want my 5m to be more like a 10m, I just pump it up with 55 pumps. Works every time....

IanR said..
Wow McTool
You really are letting your imagination and paranoia run rampant
At no point have I said that this characteristic is specific to any kite, brand or style of kiteboarding, but somehow you think it all about the Ozone Reo and surf board riding
You do realise that other brands use a pulleyless bridle system.

Ozone Kites Aus said..

Cab Drifter, I've flown this and last years a bit, they have short bridles and no pulleys, yet have a much longer depower throw than the Ozone Reo V4.

The Fact that you have used untruths to try and forward your arguments is more evidence of your inability to see things objectively. The Cab Drifter does use pulleys in its bridle and as you have stated it does have a much longer depower throw and in my opinion a more linear feel at the bar than a pulleyless design.

If you think my opinion is irrelivent, or whatever word you choose, why does it bother you so much?

Ozone Kites Aus said.
I prefer a Reo, as Pearl said you can just shut it down and ride the wave, and bring back the power when needed.

The fact that you have put words in other people's mouths, that they have actual not said in this thread, is more evidence that the persecution you feel from me is the produce of you own mind.

If, as you state, it is a need to dump the power with the exponential feel that comes from a pulleyless design why are the top five riders in the GKA Surf titles using kites that have pulleys in there bridles?

I'd say it's because they are very talented riders not the kite regardless of pulleys
But secondly and most importantly is income/ sponsorship from brands,
this is due to the chosen brands wealth, ozone arnt in the class financially as north/ cabrinah, even if they were I'd doubt they'd follow that buisness model it's not their way I'd say, ozone seem happy with there niche market that enjoy the feel of ozone kites, I'm not biased to any brand like 90 % of riders,
i have flown a big range of brands and some are great all pulleyless though and especially the 5 loaded line kites, but it's hard to go past the feel and performance of ozones , on the subject of depowering or attempting to downsizing a kite I flew a 9 as my smallest kite, not through choice basically I was skint and couldn't afford a smaller kite, to combat this I swapped the bridal single knot pigtail to a 3 knot custom one, the centre knot was the same as the single but with one 30 mm above and below, opening and closing the Le or face to the wind, allowing me to get out in stronger and lesser winds on the same kite, worked great up and down in wind range, But only to a certain level

cauncy said..

I'm not biased to any brand like 90 % of riders

Didn't you just change brands recently? I wonder which brand you're riding now...?

IanR said..
Well Cauncy

I see the whole Pro Rider thing differently.
I hope the Pro Riders Drive the design of the kite they fly and work with the designers to create a kite they really like and works for them best.

Rather than some accountant with a JIT management philosophy reducing his supply chain, Driving the design of thier Kites

i'm really happy you like kites with a pulleyless bridle, most of them fly great.

How would you explain some of norths later renditions of kites

cauncy said..
How would you explain some of norths later renditions of kites

Beyond your abliities and talent.

Why didn't you demo the Vagas or the Dice?
From what you say I would have thought those would have worked for you.