Thanks kiters, from a windsurfer

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Chris 249
Chris 249
NSW
3576 posts
NSW, 3576 posts
21 May 2012 4:22pm
As a long time and serious competitive windsurfer and boat sailor and class organiser, I'd just like to give the kiters of the internet world a genuine "thanks" for behaving so well over the Olympic decision.

Given the flak sometimes flung around between windsurfers and kiters, I could understand it if some kiters had stirred the pot about windsurfing getting dumped, but instead the kiting world has been understanding, gracious and sympathetic as far as I can see.

Well done, thanks, and good winds.


jamdfingr
jamdfingr
QLD
663 posts
QLD, 663 posts
21 May 2012 5:04pm
Agreed... you guys have behaved very well...

and that is totally against what these forums are for.....

Where are the slinging matches Kiters vs Windsurfers?

The olympic dreams stolen from a bunch of 40 year old pole boarders and given to a bunch of young dudes who wear polka dot boardies over their wetsuits....

Nah, Im just kidding, I both windsurf and kite (and neither to an olympic level) so am totally abiguous to the decision...


it is nice to see though that snide comments and pot stirring have been left aside....
dusta
dusta
WA
2940 posts
WA, 2940 posts
21 May 2012 4:43pm
jamdfingr said...

it is nice to see though that snide comments and pot stirring have been left aside....


not really
both camps have had their cry babys . The windsurfers seem to forget that windsurfing was once looked at the same way that windsurfers look at kitesurfing . Each to their own .
Rattlehead
Rattlehead
QLD
555 posts
QLD, 555 posts
21 May 2012 6:58pm
Dude you got to realize that probably a good percentage of kiters come from a sailboarding background , none of us are happy to see windsurfing dropped from the Olympic games , same thing happened several years ago with the catamarans in the games , and thanks to a huge outcry they are back for 2016 .
With any luck sailboarding will be back in the near future , hopefully they will dislodge one of the other dinosaur classes out of the games , as there are only so many spots . I think kiteboarding racing will be in for a fairly long time looking at the spectical of the racing and the overall popularity of the sport.
bjw
bjw
QLD
3690 posts
bjw bjw
QLD, 3690 posts
21 May 2012 7:53pm
Kiting is sooo mainstream ... It's nearly as popular as 1D
Mark _australia
Mark _australia
WA
23652 posts
WA, 23652 posts
21 May 2012 6:31pm
I agree, I didn't really see any smartarse "windsrfing has ben cancceled loz" comments, nor windsurfers whinging about kiters in general. I think it was a pretty mature discussion.

Let's hope for both sports in 2016.
Chris 249
Chris 249
NSW
3576 posts
NSW, 3576 posts
22 May 2012 12:07am
Rattlehead said...hopefully they will dislodge one of the other dinosaur classes out of the games , as there are only so many spots .


Sorry, you struck a raw nerve with me when you started dissing the boats. The thread was about how nice it was when people didn't diss other types of sailing, not about "dinosaur" classes that should be dumped.

I hope most of those "dinosaur" classes stay in, because they represent the types of boats that ****loads of racing sailors actually sail. Even the
Finns got TWO HUNDRED AND EIGHTY TWO masters for the worlds this year! They had 59 juniors last time the worlds were in Europe.

Compare that to either kiting OR windsurfing, where the numbers are so small that they'll just about take anyone at any title and still struggle to get much over 50-70 entries. Kites or windsurfers would wet themselves to get the numbers that even the Finn gets, and there are yacht races that get over 10,000 sailors overseas. The numbers of people who sail cruiser/racer yachts swamps all other types, and the trend over the past couple of decades has been towards leadmines, not away from them. In a lot of ways all boards are damn lucky that ISAF has dumped the keelboats that the vast majority of its members sail, instead of boards.

Why not be positive about all areas of sailing, rather than knocking them?
picker
picker
VIC
431 posts
VIC, 431 posts
22 May 2012 8:59am
Tone it down
Paul1
Paul1
QLD
1011 posts
QLD, 1011 posts
22 May 2012 9:45am
Sounds like Chis started the thread to provoke an argument.
jamdfingr
jamdfingr
QLD
663 posts
QLD, 663 posts
22 May 2012 10:23am
Nah, I think it was a genuine thanks for the mature approach to an obvious sore spot that could have been pushed....

Even though its often funny to watch the kite vs windsurf battles play out on seabreeze.
Chris 249
Chris 249
NSW
3576 posts
NSW, 3576 posts
22 May 2012 11:29am
Paul1 said...

Sounds like Chis started the thread to provoke an argument.


Nope, I genuinely started the thread to say thanks to kiters for not giving grief to another type of sailing, and then someone started doing just that....sigh.

As I mentioned, it does strike a raw nerve when sailors start dissing other parts of the sport, especially in reply to a post that was thanking them for not doing just that!

I sail just about everything. Each area of the sport is fantastic. The last thing we need is to diss each other, when we could appreciate each other and learn from each other.

1likeBJ
1likeBJ
WA
152 posts
WA, 152 posts
22 May 2012 10:36am
I've sailed all all my life in heaps of classes (dinghies, skiffs and keel boats) and represented Aus couple of times but never elite level. I agree with Chris that Olympics is focusing too much on high performance/spectator friendly classes. Anyone who has sailed rafts (catamarans) and even 49ers knows that they are way less boat-on-boat tactical than Lasers or Finns or even 470s. Winners of the last three classes I respect more because of the tighter competition and higher participation numbers in these classes.
iandvnt
iandvnt
QLD
581 posts
QLD, 581 posts
22 May 2012 5:55pm
There was a world cup event in holland a few day ago. 3 girls entered, and 2 did not finish first race. No disrespect to them.. But that is pretty weird for a potential olympic sport!
felixdcat
felixdcat
WA
3519 posts
WA, 3519 posts
22 May 2012 4:07pm
NAaaah just a total lost of interrest! Tea bagging at the OJ's................... baaaaaah who cares........ pass another beer!
ashkiter
ashkiter
QLD
431 posts
QLD, 431 posts
22 May 2012 6:36pm
Whoop Whoop Whoop



1st person registered below



craggers
craggers
WA
475 posts
WA, 475 posts
23 May 2012 11:41am
Since when was getting a sport like this into the olympics a good thing?

Isnt everyone just a bit bemused about the whole incongruence of purist/discipline types of sports (based on the Greeks concept of the strongest person/fastest person/most accurate etc) alongside modern 'creative' sports which are based on trying to do something other people are NOT doing... ie a new twist, a new invert, a combo not achieved before.

it seems a bit like a bmx stunter showing up at the tour de france, if i can use a poor example to demonstrate. Its even slightly demeaning to be wheeled out as a sideshow for the more 'respectable' set to chuckle haughtily at.

lets be honest, even the olympic commitee doesnt take this side of the games seriously, its a marketing angle to attract more viewers, with the intention of maintaining support for the classic central themes of running fast, jumping high, and behaving most like a herculean greek.

its 20 knots. i now vacate the soapbox.
KIT33R
KIT33R
NSW
1716 posts
NSW, 1716 posts
23 May 2012 4:09pm
I think many people are missing the bigger picture with kiting being accepted into the Olympics.

We are now considered a class of sailing, without dispute. We can legitimately join a sailing club and with the resources of the sailing club hold races if that's what we wish. Also, we potentially have the support of Yachting Australia, an organisation of over 60,000 members. Think about it.
Juddy
Juddy
WA
1103 posts
WA, 1103 posts
23 May 2012 3:48pm
IMO, kitesurfing is not yet mature enough in terms of numbers (around the world) to really justify participation at an Olympic level.

As I understand things (happy to be corrected), the ISAF decision was for course racing to be "the" Olympic demonstration. Whilst I understand that course racing is a bit of a growth area currently, IMO it's nowhere near as exciting as freestyle or waves, and I'll be surprised if it draws 'crowds' as much as freestyle or waves might.

If we look at the number of kiters who are actually 'in to' course racing as a proportion of the total number of kiters, it is probably a pretty small number - whilst it might be growing in popularity, the actual number of course racing enthusiasts doesn't IMO, justify Olympic demonstration.
KIT33R
KIT33R
NSW
1716 posts
NSW, 1716 posts
23 May 2012 8:06pm
Juddy said...

IMO, kitesurfing is not yet mature enough in terms of numbers (around the world) to really justify participation at an Olympic level.

As I understand things (happy to be corrected), the ISAF decision was for course racing to be "the" Olympic demonstration. Whilst I understand that course racing is a bit of a growth area currently, IMO it's nowhere near as exciting as freestyle or waves, and I'll be surprised if it draws 'crowds' as much as freestyle or waves might.

If we look at the number of kiters who are actually 'in to' course racing as a proportion of the total number of kiters, it is probably a pretty small number - whilst it might be growing in popularity, the actual number of course racing enthusiasts doesn't IMO, justify Olympic demonstration.



Locally we have found new kiters coming across from skiff racing who are not interested in TT's. All they want to do is race. It's an interesting development that has caught many of us by surprise.
hamburglar
hamburglar
ACT
2174 posts
ACT, 2174 posts
24 May 2012 12:39am
felixdcat said...

NAaaah just a total lost of interrest! Tea bagging at the OJ's................... baaaaaah who cares........ pass another beer!


is pole dancing still a sport

Rattlehead
Rattlehead
QLD
555 posts
QLD, 555 posts
25 May 2012 8:29pm
Chris 249 said...

Rattlehead said...hopefully they will dislodge one of the other dinosaur classes out of the games , as there are only so many spots .


Sorry, you struck a raw nerve with me when you started dissing the boats. The thread was about how nice it was when people didn't diss other types of sailing, not about "dinosaur" classes that should be dumped.

I hope most of those "dinosaur" classes stay in, because they represent the types of boats that ****loads of racing sailors actually sail. Even the
Finns got TWO HUNDRED AND EIGHTY TWO masters for the worlds this year! They had 59 juniors last time the worlds were in Europe.


Compare that to either kiting OR windsurfing, where the numbers are so small that they'll just about take anyone at any title and still struggle to get much over 50-70 entries. Kites or windsurfers would wet themselves to get the numbers that even the Finn gets, and there are yacht races that get over 10,000 sailors overseas. The numbers of people who sail cruiser/racer yachts swamps all other types, and the trend over the past couple of decades has been towards leadmines, not away from them. In a lot of ways all boards are damn lucky that ISAF has dumped the keelboats that the vast majority of its members sail, instead of boards.

Why not be positive about all areas of sailing, rather than knocking them?



I didn't mean to upset anyone but in my opinion the Finns and the stars have no place in the olympic's . Both are an ancient designs And as boring as **** to watch ,tried watching them racing in Perth before Xmas on TV and nearly fell asleep., and let's be realistic in Australia they are dinosaurs . I have sailed a Finn once about 25 years ago ,and since then I have seen 3 others in the flesh . In my opion not exactly a everyday class , check out the link for the nationals entry list , 18 boats ..... http://www.adelaidesailingclub.com.au/Entry/ViewEntriesPublic.aspx?EID=39269&Format=popup

Stars are a dinosaur class ,in 35 years of sailing I've seen 2 on a hard stand ,never seen either of them ever in the water , and last year I saw 1 on a trailer driving down the highway.

You got to remember these classes have been round 50 years or so...let's see how big the kite racing fleet is in 50 years.
JohnnoKeys
JohnnoKeys
WA
551 posts
WA, 551 posts
25 May 2012 9:37pm
IMO I think 99% of kliters & windsurfers have no idea of the actual amazing performance of kite racing boards from 6 to 15 knots and up to a mind bending 25/30 knots. The 2012 race board and kites are actually very mature in their performance and handling and are easy to ride at extreme speeds if you put in the time. For bang for your buck in wind sports from 6 to 15 knots nothing comes close for a balls to the wall rush when most kite freestyle and wave riders are bitching on the beach about no wind.

I think the people who organise these things were shown a easy to organize, extreme performance sport that could be raced legitamitely from 6 to 15 knots and above if wind fills in. On my race board In 6 to 10 knots I average 15 knots around a 4 km triangle up wind coarse with max speeds of 22/23 knots down wind, radical when you think most other kiters on beach can't even keep a kite in the air.

This link may shed some light on people who organize racing events from 2 days ago...

http://kiteracingblog.blogspot.it/2012/05/us-sailing-statement-on-kiteboarding-vs.html

P.S I use my raceboard because nothing else works in kiting in light winds and gives me an excuse to pissoff from work and get on the water in very light winds.

WAKSA is organizing a new 2012/2013 kite raceing series focusing on fun and learning how to ride and race / rather than race results on night from 6 to 15 knots plus. If anyone wants to race at a higher level this series will help to give you the skills. At a minimum series will get you out of work and on water LIT in 6 to 15 knots.
Smithy
Smithy
VIC
859 posts
VIC, 859 posts
26 May 2012 12:53pm
The sad thing is with all olympic sailing classes is that it difficult for the spectators with most courses being set offshore.

Sorry for my ignorance, is the kiting going to be based on a one design concept? When windsurfing was introduced there was only a couple of the chosen one design model in Australia. One design course racing, including the original Windsurfer class, also only made up a very small percentage of what windsurfing was actually about, at least in Australia anyway.

The disappointment for many was that the spectacle of wave sailing or even slalom racing would never be seen and the sport would not get the exposure as we had all hoped it would.
wal269
wal269
WA
718 posts
WA, 718 posts
26 May 2012 12:31pm
Johnno Keys

what kites are you using in 6 -10 knots?

I know you are the richest guy in Perth and prob can afford the some customized SpaceX developed Lithium gas kite but are you using off the shelf?

I love your stoke for course racing, which of course I retired from when I beat you in the Rotto race. Wal 1 John 0..... I am happy to go out with a perfect will loss ratio against national champ.

seriously though, am interested in kite choice.

even giving you a chance to spruik!
JohnnoKeys
JohnnoKeys
WA
551 posts
WA, 551 posts
26 May 2012 3:21pm
I not so sure $$$ the Real estate market has been pretty tough over last 12 months...

Yes mate, all the 2012 17m race kites are great, all standard issue nothing fancy just very lite for size ( mine about 4.1kg ) & fewer struts on most with quite a small front diameter leading edge, any brand, Ozone, Cabrinha, Airrush, North, RRD etc etc , I use a 17m Ozone Edge and it rocks, they are very different to big kites from years ago, very easy to fly, just rock up wind and turn very fast for size. You can also relaunch in 6-8 knots if you know how as they are pretty high aspect and long. I'm using a 85 litre raceboard so not sure what bottom end you would get on TT or surfboard, but I reckon probaly 8 - 10 knots on surfboad with a bit of volume. Have a go on mine any time you got a minute just text me your number and I'll let you know when we are kiting - Also used the 17m in 15 to 18knots, other race kiters on day were lit on 13m kites and the 17m was OK to use at top end and not out of control or scary at all. In old dayz in 18knots my 20m X2 would have been totally over powered & dangerous.

ANY DAY with your mates in in exotic locations, with 15knots plus of wind, 9m kite on a surfboard in proper down the line 4ft plus waves kills kite racing - any day - anyway- any how - no question - BUT
but when the windz are **** in Perth you get to go and have some fun.
Peterc150
Peterc150
VIC
710 posts
VIC, 710 posts
26 May 2012 11:55pm
I don't think windsurfing should have been dropped in favour of kitesurfing. Both sports should be at the Olympics.

There could also be a downside for kitesurfing - some locations are now already quite crowded.

I agree with Juddy too - course racing is currently a very small part of the sport - and I have a race board (sort of, Sector 60).

www.peterskiteboarding.com/2012/05/kitesurfing-in-olympic-games-but.html
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