and seriously long lines (end of vid)

Still think I'd take out a flysurfer any day over this. (cost permitting)

Kitepower Australia said...

Saffer said...

Still think I'd take out a flysurfer any day over this. (cost permitting)

Sure the Flysurfers can go in this little wind too, but they need to be the bigger special fabric ones, so expect to pay nearly double the price!
However, the Edge will leave a FS in its tracks for downwind performance, and is just as good upwind, plus its a lot more fun when the wind picks up in my experience.

Bucket lid hmmm. Maybe its to keep his head warm? Looks pretty cold. Long lines at the end yeah they are long for sure, but thats how to get very light wind performance like this from a 15M kite. Notice how he bogged a bit in the gybes and tacks until he worked the kite and got some apparent going.

Agree the music is a bit OTT but they are euro, its what they do

I'm not sure if you can call riding on a board the size of a yacht more fun...a comparable 15m FS would at least match or better this for performance (even without the lightweight material) and a 19 or 21 would make the Edge its personal b|tch.

Kitepower Australia said...

Nothing personal, but you may have trouble perceiving the fun in low wind cruising or Course Racing, and others froth over it.

The board in that video looks like its a larger than normal course racing board, so having 2 course racing boards for many people would be a bit OTT too.
I don't think the FS would, and to date they have not been winning much in the various course races around the world.

I doubt that you have flown the new Edge, and wonder if you have flown FS Speed3 kites 15M and larger too? Special edition? So its just speculation on your part, and possibly some bias too.

Ozone Edge low wind and racing results are available and at the pointy end of modern high performance kites and therefore quite credible.

Your post was about light wind kiting, not racing but since we're on the topic of light wind (10-12knot) course racing, its seems to be pretty consistent that when the wind is light, flysurfer still seem to win so that should say something. I have no doubt there are better kites when the wind picks up, if there wasn't, everyone would have smaller flysurfers and we don't see a hell of a lot of them around here:

http://www.flysurfer.com/News/article/1465/
www.flysurfer.com/News/article/3244/
results.extremience.com/KST2010DahmeResultsRace.htm (2010)

You can say what you want about bias, but the one thing I've always noticed is when the wind is too light to kite, there is always someone out there on a 19m flysurfer having fun when most kites can't even get in the air. The only kite I've seen with remotely comparable low end was one of the fluid Ultra-flat kites I tried but it took longer to turn than a independent politician takes to make up their mind.

In St Peter Ording, Germany, you get to see a lot of Flysurfers. They are hands down the last ones that can stay out when it gets light.
However when the wind really drops, you witness people trying to relaunch the thing for 20 minutes and then come in with a wet bag and huge bridle spaghetti..
The turning performance looks very sluggish also, which I guess is why they aren't any good on the downwind leg. One reason certainly is that they aren't as rigid as LEIs, but also the weight of the air mass trapped in the foil chambers is huge. Upwind they seem to smoke everyone though, but I suppose that's more because of the extremely high AR, and not because the foil profile is more efficient.
So they are certainly special and probably the ultimate solution if your main goal is to stay upwind in the lightest breeze.

Saffer said...

Your post was about light wind kiting, not racing but since we're on the topic of light wind (10-12knot) course racing, its seems to be pretty consistent that when the wind is light, flysurfer still seem to win so that should say something. I have no doubt there are better kites when the wind picks up, if there wasn't, everyone would have smaller flysurfers and we don't see a hell of a lot of them around here:

http://www.flysurfer.com/News/article/1465/

Thats from 2007, not really relevant old kites, and old technology.

Saffer said...
www.flysurfer.com/News/article/3244/

Again, irrelevant results, from a snow and ice race in Russia on Speed 2 kites in 2009

Saffer said...
results.extremience.com/KST2010DahmeResultsRace.htm (2010)

Again results irrelevant IMO, only 4 riders finished 2 races and more than half the filed was Flysurfer.

Saffer said...
You can say what you want about bias, but the one thing I've always noticed is when the wind is too light to kite, there is always someone out there on a 19m flysurfer having fun when most kites can't even get in the air. The only kite I've seen with remotely comparable low end was one of the fluid Ultra-flat kites I tried but it took longer to turn than a independent politician takes to make up their mind.

Have not got time to go and find the results where inflatable kites from Cabrinha, Ozone and North, etc clean up the racing. The current world champion Course racing Plenty of people see me out riding on Botany Bay on Ozone 2011 Edge 15M or Ozone Zephyr 2011, when nothing else can get off the beach.
I have seen other riders on a few occasions who can get out and yes they were on Flysurfer kites

Check the results on this site, not many FS there
www.regattanetwork.com/clubmgmt/applet_regatta_results.php?regatta_id=2696&show_divisions=1

Adam Koch and Ozone winners here
www.surfertoday.com/kiteboarding/3348-adam-koch-and-kari-schibevaag-win-the-2010-ika-racing-worlds

Interesting vid indeed, thanks for sharing.

Long lines and huge board aside, that is still pretty impressive.

Looks a lot more worthwhile than the bad old days of kites twice that size that only really managed to truck you down wind in more wind than that.

I want to see a video of him relaunching it in that wind though. Just because you can ride doesn't mean you should...

Kitepower Australia said...

Saffer said...
http://results.extremience.com/KST2010DahmeResultsRace.htm (2010)

Again results irrelevant IMO, only 4 riders finished 2 races and more than half the filed was Flysurfer.

Did you ever think about why only 4 riders finished? We are talking light wind and that was the original premise of your post. I.e. the wind was too light for any other competitors to finish. i.e. the flysurfers performed the best in conditions that other riders could not even complete the race.

I have no doubt there are better racing kites, but your post is entitled "Seriously low wind kiting", not "Best course racing kite on the market".

Saffer said...

I have no doubt there are better racing kites, but your post is entitled "Seriously low wind kiting", not "Best course racing kite on the market".

Thats the point of my post, lots of course racing happens in light winds, the rider in the video I posted is riding an aircraft carrier sized course racing board but still kiting in winds well under 10 knots on a 15M inflatable kite. Foils are not the only light wind alternative anymore, and they still need to be on huge boards too to get those under 10 knots performances. The Ozone Edge 2011 is a seriously good low wind kite thats still fun to fly in stronger winds and is not a slow turning monster size kite with a large price tag (can even be purchased kite only works on many 50cm 4 line bars).

meerkat said...

This should be titled:

SERIOUSLY BORING KITING.

If the wind is so sh!t that i need to use a 15m kite I rather do something else, anything else.

Haven't used anything bigger than a 9m in donkeys and wouldn't use an 11metre kiteboard like this bloke if hell froze over.

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

I reckon you would use a big kite/board and kite in light winds if you truly have the kitesurfing addiction and you found yourself living and working in some area that experienced a lot of light winds!

And if these threads annoy you, do yourself a favour, don't click on them.

Kitepower Australia said...

meerkat said...

This should be titled:

SERIOUSLY BORING KITING.

If the wind is so sh!t that i need to use a 15m kite I rather do something else, anything else.

Haven't used anything bigger than a 9m in donkeys and wouldn't use an 11metre kiteboard like this bloke if hell froze over.

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

I reckon you would use a big kite/board and kite in light winds if you truly have the kitesurfing addiction and you found yourself living and working in some area that experienced a lot of light winds!

And if these threads annoy you, do yourself a favour, don't click on them.

I used to live somewhere with sh!t light wind, then got bored so moved somewhere windy. Simple really.

The thread isn't annoying, just the self proclaiming heros of light wind kiting.

Lucky he has a lid on, he could do himself some serious damage falling asleep and hitting his head on his board.

Up in Shark Bay one of the boys bought a 17m fuel, back in the days of no safety release, just try to pull the bugger off the harness if things got sketchy.
It was good fun watching him try to get out of it when the wind started blowing 30 knots. Just make sure you have few hundred metres of water to deal with it before landfall....

GalahOnTheBay said...

Kitepower Australia said...

a slow turning monster size kite with a large price tag

Ahh those were the days - I miss my big kites...

GOLD! Christ I have not laughed as hard as that in ages. Brilliant.