If it aint broke, don't fix it.... Naish tried something new(and it tanked).

stabber said...
If it aint broke, don't fix it.... Naish tried something new(and it tanked).

Are you referring to the naish RIDE OR FLY, I had a go and there not too bad. Gr8 for newbies for there first couple seasons in the sport, really looking forward to their new draft when it's out for demo days

Plummet said...

Now i'm not so sure. I haven't seen much significant advancement in the last 2 years.

I think some people are that clueless,they couldnt pick the advancements of the same model of kite each year if their life depended on it.

Maybe your on to some new marketing technique ;)

Plummet said...

As above.

Have we seen the majority of significant kite design and now the designs will be tweaked for slightly different riding style.

It used to be that year on year each kite was better and better.

Now i'm not so sure. I haven't seen much significant advancement in the last 2 years.

there is always a long way to go we just can't see what's not yet come out

. . . . its been years since Wainman predicted that kites will one day do flyloops and i think they are still a long way off - but i can't wait for that day it will be insane . . . and that's just a single trick . . . bring it on

with twin-skins and bridles everything about the geometry of a kite is up for grabs and able to evolve in many more ways than bridle less or mini bridle kites

Armin (flysurfer) has been quoted in the past as saying kite by kite year by year they hit the wall seemingly impossible to surpass even by a small amount then eventually they manage to break through and normally in a much bigger way than expected

so my opinion is "No" . . . , bring on the kiting future

Dear me where's Paul1 when you need him as I'm sure we'd all be fascinated and intrigued by his marvellous display of intellect and insight...

Good question. How much have cars changed in the past 30 years? Some would argue a lot and they have but the basic principles have not.

Eventually a conceptual idea/ design is like a caterpillar, that is trying its best to crawl faster and faster. Then one day it metamorphosis into something completely different and can now fly.

Another analogy could be when Einstein proved the only constant in the Universe was the speed of light, Copernicus the sun center stage etc etc...revolutionary game changing ideas.

Until this occurs in our little world of kite design then I say no to your question. We will not see the same exponential increase in performance, safety etc we have seen in the years mentioned. Just tweaks...but don't underestimate the power of tweaks.

What I see ( and some company did try it and they were horrible!), is a compilation of a double skin kite with the LEI, and of course bridal and material changes, to produce a highly efficient yet manageable foil.

But hey just an impossible probable, let the De bono free in your heads, cause there are much smarter people out there than me that would indeed one day do something very awesome with what is a very awesome experience.


Ps a which farqwit red thumbed this thread. Honestly, are you just too stupid to actually contribute. Can't say some flippant pathetic remark. No hum getting tired of stupidity...might sign out for while...see ya.

Ps on a side note and unrelated, I hope all the crew have an awesome time at kite stock..let us know how it went. Would have been there but instead I was getting spewed all over including in the mouth by my very sick 6 yr old daughter for the last two days. Nothing like spew in your mouth...mmmmm



So Paul1, anything to add to this post or is it lame?

Thanks for the mention Eppo, it makes me feel all warm inside being stalked by a dude on the internet.

In my opinion, I believe that kites are due another big leap forward in design, it has been a little stagnated the last few years, there has been improvement in wave dedicated kites, mainly due to lighter materials and 3 strut design, but as others have said only small refinements. Maybe there will be a new stiffer fabric that will make the strutless kites more viable? Boards are another area that could do with a change up, apart from materials and slight refinements in rocker, length, channels, width and flex patterns there is not an awful lot they can tamper with.

When winter hits Perth, I will be thankful that kite design has stagnated...I don't want to go any higher than you already can on a 7m core GT in 40 knots. BOOOOOOOOOOOST

airjunkie said...

Plummet said...

As above.

Have we seen the majority of significant kite design and now the designs will be tweaked for slightly different riding style.

It used to be that year on year each kite was better and better.

Now i'm not so sure. I haven't seen much significant advancement in the last 2 years.

there is always a long way to go we just can't see what's not yet come out

. . . . its been years since Wainman predicted that kites will one day do flyloops and i think they are still a long way off - but i can't wait for that day it will be insane . . . and that's just a single trick . . . bring it on

with twin-skins and bridles everything about the geometry of a kite is up for grabs and able to evolve in many more ways than bridle less or mini bridle kites

Armin (flysurfer) has been quoted in the past as saying kite by kite year by year they hit the wall seemingly impossible to surpass even by a small amount then eventually they manage to break through and normally in a much bigger way than expected

so my opinion is "No" . . . , bring on the kiting future

what is a fly loop?

Fly Loop:

The Inflatable kite may well be close to its best design in current non-specialised format.. Stagnated - heavy word - but applied to anything which changes less than say 2% in 12-18 months - then yes...

Early eighties - Hang-gliding was in a rut - with High drag profile slow speed fun machines with a lot of limits...
Then
- 30% double skin came in (the Atlas - French design!!) then 60% up to 85+%
- Better fabrics - less stretch - tighter wing profiles
- floating keel pockets
- Floating cross bars - + variable wing geometry
- much more profiled battens... etc
- body bag harnesses

Result - top speed 3+ times greater whilst keeping bottom end speed and control (well most of it) - the envelope of the possible really expanded - at the time (in my 20's - jumped at the changes - loved the evolution).

For the next 10+ years it retained the generic top end shape as the must buy model.. bringing most of a shrinking market with it. Then a range of simpler return to the slower fun flying machines concept re-evolved. The market models split to appeal to an audience. The front runner designs pushed the club flier to their limits physically and skill wise (+ good bang 4 buck but expensive)....

The same changes in aerodynamics will start to be applied to the Inflatable kites - the aim to expand the wind range the speed and the lower the effort needed for endurance. I wonder what shapes could evolve if the C of G was moved back - with a possible bridal support on the center strut - so hybrid between foil and Inflatable kites.

The key to the current designs is the retained simplicity of fitting it all into a small rut sack to go home with. From 7-77+ yo can use it - it offers sophistication and is really crude (Think self-launch on a beach - think beach ball valve (some are better now) - multi-purpose fabric (tents etc). The main unique feature of a kite and 'IP' is its control bar - now how much more can you do with this???.

I think evolution is likely to create the specialist fit - for racing - for enduro - etc.
Look at how close (not) the sailing speed record boat is to a dinghy....

The market is till expanding, whilst it is the generic multi-purpose kite will dominate.
Off the shelf parts are cheap(er) - Given the choice of this against say adding some semi-rigid parts into the kite??? so I am ok with stagnant.

FWIW - I still have a lot of catching up to do to maximise the current design..

Cheers
AP

Strutless

Plummet said...
some interesting comments. I want to see a kite fly loop now! imagine that madness.

Jump of the building\mountain with short lines and do it? :)))

Hey dafrog that was really interesting ideas man...I also to feel the development in the near future may come from foils.

...magnetic fields with no lines...origami kites...man was that LSD induced cause it's way out there and very very cool.

dafrog said...
I've seen photos of a guy that decided to have 2 kites linked together to kite in low wind...

Why not ask the people on this forum who have tried it an know why that particular trick doesn't work

Hint: You might be able to ride, but getting upwind is a whole other story...

(apologies for the atrocious music)

eppo said...


Good question. How much have cars changed in the past 30 years? Some would argue a lot and they have but the basic principles have not.

all major components of the modern motor car were invented before the end of 1933.