110,000 signatures in 5 days.

Sign here if you'd like the government to keep the original, vastly superior but slightly more expensive NBN:
www.change.org/p/the-liberal-party-of-australia-reconsider-your-plan-for-a-fttn-nbn-in-favour-of-a-superior-ftth-nbn


An article: www.abc.net.au/news/2013-09-10/university-student-petition-to-scrap-nbn-takes-off-online/4949372

Where is the third documents to scrap both plans all together ?
Couldn't we just leave this as is ? Business model not government enterprise ?
When I needed broadband for my business I had fiber lay down to my door premises within week or two at no cost for me at all ?
The only problem that last few meters was on the copper but that could / should be negotiated without the need for complete new enterprise.

www.brisbanetimes.com.au/technology/malcolm-turnbull-gives-thumbs-down-to-fibre-nbn-petition-20130911-hv1po.html

-and -

www.brisbanetimes.com.au/it-pro/it-opinion/coalition-to-take-axe-to-nbn-co-20130910-hv1pm.html

Right, so next time I see a 3 yr old at the polling booths, I can dismiss them as having been coached.

I'm with Macroscien on this one.
Although working in IT and the lure of gigabit + network speeds, the economics of fibre to the premises does not add up.
The NBN is a nation building bit of infrastructure akin to the 21st century version of the Snowy River scheme, but with mounting national debt, the fibre to the node model is cheaper & faster to deploy. The last hop to the premises can be done at a later date, or if you can't wait, run it yourself or let business provide plans that include this.
Lets spend the estimated $15 billion saving on something else.

pepe47 said..

Nor

Macroscien said..

pepe47 said.. Right, so next time I see a 3 yr old at the polling booths, I can dismiss them as having been coached.

That is right. The 3 y.o is not interested in your NBN ( that for sure), didn't acquired porn habits yet.

Nor are they eligible to vote But they're still part of the population equation.

You missed the point.
We have not problem to provide the fastest fiber ever to 0.5% internet fanatics in this country.
Right now, without any penny more, no need to wait.
But if this 0.5% demand to supply the fiber to remaining 99.5% population that have other staff to worry about and not interested or even heard about NBN,
that demand could not be met

Macroscien said..

pepe47 said.. Nor

Macroscien said..

pepe47 said.. Right, so next time I see a 3 yr old at the polling booths, I can dismiss them as having been coached.

That is right. The 3 y.o is not interested in your NBN ( that for sure), didn't acquired porn habits yet.

Nor are they eligible to vote But they're still part of the population equation.

You missed the point. We have not problem to provide the fastest fiber ever to 0.5% internet fanatics in this country. Right now, without any penny more, no need to wait. But if this 0.5% demand to supply the fiber to remaining 99.5% population that have other staff to worry about and not interested or even heard about NBN, that demand could not be met

No, I don't think I'm missing the point. I think YOU may be missing the final tally of the petition. What they're saying is that the tally so far, is 110,000 signatures within the relatively short span of 5 days.
Then we might be able to revisit the percentage of the population eligible to vote.

Macro, Westoz, we've been... ahem... robustly discussing.. the virtues of the NBN on here for months. Please don't come in now with nonsense and make everyone start all over again with the same arguements.

FTTN is *not* faster to deploy, just sounds it on paper before you start doing it. It requires pits, power, nodes with UPS/backup batteries, and council permission for 80,000 sites. NBN rollout guys will tell you it's faster just to run the cable.

Economics add up - never costs anywhere near the same to do things piecemeal, cheapest way is always in bulk, do it at once. go into your street pits ONCE and pull all the fibre, not 47 individual times as you make people pay.

Total costings, inc copper maintenance, show FTTN a very similar cost. So why not do it right? And avoid ugly fridge cabinets on every other street corner while you're at it?

Micro - it's not about home downloads it's about replacing copper with the next gen, breaking telstra's monopoly, and thinking ahead.

There's the 20 second recap, please go read all the other NBN threads.

kiteboy dave said..
breaking telstra's monopoly,.

fine but before I do that( read all the threads back) could you remind in short
how are you going to benefit on replacement - one monopoly with another one government one this time ? What guaranties that one is better then another one ?
I am not attacking technical aspect but organisational. Telstra could provide you with fiber straight to your computers too.

Probably everything finish like breaking power companies monopoly. Now you end up paying separate to electricity generators, network operator, retailer.
Ends up paying 45c for electricity worth in real terms 6- 8 c/ kw ( that is what they pay you back for your solar FIT)

The extra cost of doing this job properly is spent over the years the project takes to complete. 15billion over 10 successive bugets is a drop in the ocean. For some reason we do need to increase defence spending though...

How far have we gone with the NBN so far? ie; regardless of your position on the subject - is it worth pulling out now or best to finish it and cop the costs?

pepe47 said..

Macroscien said..

pepe47 said.. Nor

Macroscien said..

pepe47 said.. Right, so next time I see a 3 yr old at the polling booths, I can dismiss them as having been coached.

That is right. The 3 y.o is not interested in your NBN ( that for sure), didn't acquired porn habits yet.

Nor are they eligible to vote But they're still part of the population equation.

You missed the point. We have not problem to provide the fastest fiber ever to 0.5% internet fanatics in this country. Right now, without any penny more, no need to wait. But if this 0.5% demand to supply the fiber to remaining 99.5% population that have other staff to worry about and not interested or even heard about NBN, that demand could not be met

No, I don't think I'm missing the point. I think YOU may be missing the final tally of the petition. What they're saying is that the tally so far, is 110,000 signatures within the relatively short span of 5 days.
Then we might be able to revisit the percentage of the population eligible to vote.

Tell you what -

Lets have a mandatory, country wide vote on the issue, then there can be no speculation about who saw the petition.

Lets have a choice in the vote -
box 1 : tick to spend $40b to connect every property in the country to fibre, whether somebody lives in the property or not and lets, for the sake of the argument, call this box the Allied Lending out other peoples money People (or ALP)

Box 2 : tick if you want something else that is even more stupid, lets call this option the Coalition of Looneys and Numbskulls (or LN Coalition for short)

then several other boxes for people who have no idea what they actually want, one of which we could call the Green with envy at the other parties who know what they want Mob (or 'Greens' for short)

Now - lets make everyone who is not insane tick at least one box and see what the real result is.


Crazy idea I know.

Already 180,000 and counting...

I must sign. O goody I can beat that guy online gaming by .00045 seconds
We must have the worlds fastest internet, so I can download a movie in .00044 seconds.
I don't care how much it costs, give it to me, I think I will vote twice. like at the election.

Harrow said..

Already 180,000 and counting...

Wake me up when you reach ...

23,177,000.00 divided by 2 plus 1

CMC said..

It won't happen.

Why do you think Murdoch wanted the Libs in so bad? It's simply to protect cable TV sales. Every other country with fast net (read most) cable TV sales have fallen heavily.

It was a major election issue so they will just say they were given a mandate that Australia did not want it. Game over regardless if Murdoch media presented all of the benefits of the slower slightly cheaper version...

Pay TV subscriptions is declining in Australia anyway. A fiber optic network would not have much of an effect one way or another. Most subscribers to pay TV got it in the nineties or early naughties. There probably have not been that many new subscribers since then. Check out the ads on Foxtel, 90% of them are for funeral insurance. Older people are their target market. The main problem pay TV has is not the NBN, its the fact most of the shows on it are rubbish and younger people have found alternatives with existing technology.


If we get the NBN I really doubt my Internet/TV/Music consumption would change all that much. Right now I can download a HD show recently aired in America quicker than I can watch it. This is with ADSL2. No fiber to the home. Of course this speed is not available everywhere. What should be a priority is improving access in areas where decent broadband Internet is not currently available. That would be the best bang for the buck.