if karma works, a few of those people are going to come back as export cattle to Indo[}:)]
Heard that we are also doubling our help to Indonesia from 4.5 to 9 billions does that sounds right?????

just my point... the money could be spent here to help ease the pain caused by Indonesia to OZ tax payers, instead of sending money just send meat that had been processed here by halal butchers!
Sending money helps the corrupt pollies of indo!

I'm all for live animal export and happy that the ban has been lifted.

Exactly.
The whole ban was a typical Australian kneejerk reaction. I mean bloody hell, the footage wasn't even that disturbing at all. Sure, it could all be done a little cleaner and more humanely, but to ban all exports because of footage of an abattoir where cows were tripping over and hitting their heads and having their throats slit...get over it.

Don't blame the abattoir workers. Blame those who's job it is to ensure that these things don't occur.

subasurf said...
I'm all for live animal export and happy that the ban has been lifted.

+1

Typical.... government does nothing

Sounds like Indo needs all the help it can get???
How bout spending our billions in Australia

subasurf said...

FormulaNova said...

I could be wrong though, so until I google it I reserve the right to be wrong

(Edit)I just re-read what you wrote. I guess if you are talking about refrigeration over there (instead of on a boat), then maybe that does have something to do with it.

I was about to correct you but saw you caught yourself :P
Yes, one of the big issues, albeit no the only one, is the lack of refrigeration in many/most parts of Indonesia where the meat is intended to go.

Adoy said...

How bout spending our billions in Australia

Nothing wrong with looking after your neighbours when you can.

That doesn't make sens! Where is the meat going after the cattle has been killed in Indo???? In the shops maybe? so the shops have no refrigeration? maybe so but they still buy dead meat so they could buy frozen meat as easily... would be very cheap to set up cold storage in lieu of slaughter houses?
By the way do they eat the meat as soon as been killed??? Not sure about that... meat must rest for about 10 days before consumption!

Yoko Ono Cites “Confessions of An Economic Hitman” In OMagazine (copy and paste)

Woaw must read it if Yoko recommend it!

This government is incompetent.

Bungling, blithering idiots.

I am embarrassed by their actions, and completely understand why Indonesia may be offended.

Sorry loggy, the path that was taken by the government is Julia Gillard's fault. You can blame my next-door neighbours dog if it makes you happy, or Tony, or Joe, or that other Joe (Ludwig). Buck stops with the PM. Responsibility.

Pugwash said...

Sorry loggy, the path that was taken by the government is Julia Gillard's fault. You can blame my next-door neighbours dog if it makes you happy, or Tony, or Joe, or that other Joe (Ludwig). Buck stops with the PM. Responsibility.

I've got 3 big problems about the whole thing.

Little Jon said...

Pugwash said...

This government is incompetent.

Bungling, blithering idiots.

I am embarrassed by their actions, and completely understand why Indonesia may be offended.

Its not the government's fault, they were forced to act once it became public. All criminal acts need to be investigated. The beef industry body that is in competent as they should of not made it public information. What did they think would happen? The farmers need better people running the industry. Before the organisation with the video took it to the ABC, they took it to the industry and said it need not become public information if they would fix the problem. The industry said they would not do anything which was a very stupid thing to do.

Bollocks , it was the govt who reacted so quickly because they are ,and will continue to be , nailed in all the polls, then it was a case of oooppps , maybe the 6 mth ban might not be such a good idea (back to the poor showing in the polls again) we can now resume live exports.
The cruelty shown was abhorrent, no doubt, but a little more thought (impossible from Julia) might have been to send a small team of experts in the killing humanely of animals field,or what ever they are called ,to go there imediately and train the abattoir workers in the correct procedure. Rather than react to the opinion polls.
You, Julia , and the rest of her poindexter crew must have their heads up their arses, not to be able to see that , indecisive decisions made in the heat of the moment , will not change the inevitable, she will definitely be replaced , and rememered as a complete incompetant









sorry loggy , I know by your previous posts you have a red headed blow up doll with a big nose ,whom you love, I dont mean to offend her

I read that the footage was taken seven months prior to it being aired by people who went to take footage with the aim of shutting down the live export industry.

It was also pointed out how the people in the footage appeared to be smiling and almost clowning around for the cameras.

Not saying what I read I take to be true, but also not sure that saying lifting of the ban is triumph of pro-lobby groups over animal welfare.

Everyone has an agenda and I am sure uses whatever means they can get away with.

Wowsers... Julia's crew had nothing to do with it... it is all someone else fault. Here is a picture of a river in Egypt:

Is interesting following this guys...

“I'm all for live animal export and happy that the ban has been lifted.”
I am a career cattle farmer – long term and have been involved in Live Export as a supplier and worked in the Aussie side of the Export industry. I fully support exporting to markets which have world recognized animal welfare standards and practices in place equal to our own and only those! Yes the total ban contained a knee jerk reaction and has been a disaster for Australian Agriculture. However it is not all B&W or easy...

“Is it really worth denying a whole very profitable, close and farmer sustaining industry for the sake of a couple of dodgy joints? Why not just specify that you will not supply those particular places?”
We have been exporting to buyers who supply approx 120 abattoirs in Indonesia [possibly more]. Post the 4 Corners episode, consultation within industry took place that came up with approx 50 abattoirs that were believed to use stunning and satisfied all welfare standards equal to ours. Then it dropped to 25 abattoirs that met our equivalent standards. Then as talks progressed it dropped to 7 definite and maybe 10 at most suitable abattoirs. This held a massive grey area and the minority was no longer a minority... We could have supplied the definite's and I wish we had that opportunity, however the scale of the problem at hand soon appeared much larger.

“I mean bloody hell, the footage wasn't even that disturbing at all.”
I found it blooding sickening and a bloody disgrace witnessing what I saw and that we had cattle going to those types of operations. Disturbing is an understatement! I have been a long time supporter and supplier of cattle to this Indo market and to think that our cattle had been treated like that enraged me! Any animal treated in such a way is shocking... Here is a quote from one of Australia's largest cattle producers [Heytesbury] supplying the Indo export market – “Profits are not an excuse for an animal to be treated that way," I totally agree as do many others.

“Would it be better if they just bought from another country and treated the animals the same way?” They have been importing Buffalo from India for quite sometime already. The first time I heard of it was approx 8 years ago. The Indonesian buyers have also been looking to Brazil and Africa for a number of years and have been deliberately reducing the number of Aussie cattle entering Indonesia since they imposed a 350kg live-weight ceiling for each suitable animal at the commencement of the export season in 2010. As of 2010 our live cattle exports to Indonesia have dropped 33%! They find a cheaper supplier, they will go there...

“I am sure that the cost of refrigerating most of an animal is cheaper than shipping the whole animal and feeding it onboard.”
We Aussies have some of the highest production and labour costs in the western world and this is also the case in Agriculture. They buy our cattle live and lighter in weight as it is much cheaper for them to ship them, grow them and finally process them there. This is why our live export trade exists. These countries can not afford and/or will not pay the substantially higher cost for our beef grown and processed here. Another issue is Halal slaughter. Tho we have Halal slaughtermen in near all Australian abattoirs, there are still the Islamic followers who will not accept stunning or us doing it here. This is a problem right now as they will not fully agree to stun in all Indo abattoirs that previously received our cattle. Actually some senior Indo Agriculture officials have said they will sign no guarantee. There is a push in some Islamic quarters to have reversible stunning [as against non-reversible stunning] – where the animal awakens after the knife cut/slash and is alive to bleed to death. For many purists, the animal must be alive as it bleeds! I wont go into that, tho will say – Thats F@@k'd!

“I am embarrassed by their actions, and completely understand why Indonesia may be offended.” Indonesia offended? When I was actively involved in the live export industry I remember another occasion when Indonesia refused to renew import permits at the 10th hour, for our cattle. It was a political stunt and designed to hurt our producers and bring down prices. They reversed it sometime later, but let the industry sweat, to show they had the upper hand. Some years later, as the export season was to commence in 2010, they dropped the 350kg live-weight bombshell on us, which suddenly made many 1000s of cattle ineligible due to being over weight for the "new" specs and if you could get them to take any slightly heavier cattle, the price paid was brought back considerably. Last winter - Many 10s of 1000s of cattle left WA's North for the eastern and Sth OZ markets at a financial loss to the station owner because of this. If it wasn't for high demand from the interstate buyers due to the great season they were having, many of our WA Station owners who were reliant on Indonesia would have been finished because of the 2010 export season! Indo bureaucracy does as it wants, when it wants and always has. They are in this as a business and for the money and at times with little care for us. Dont worry too much about offending. I dont!

“1. the MLA is the responsible authority......and they aren't. THEY jeopardized the live trade by not ensuring the animals were dealt with humanely.” I agree - The MLA and Live Corp have much responsibility to hold in this. Yes we farmers, well a number of us are trying to make them accountable right now. Including me personally. We fund them thru a compulsory levy. After 18 years we got to this stage. They had plenty of time to get the job done right, but they didn't! Ludwigs predecessor who knew of the Indonesian animal welfare issues 2 years ago and did nothing, also has a hell of a lot to answer to.

I am happy to hear the Export ban has been lifted on "APPROVED" facilities. Maybe some of the station owners can ease some of the loss they will make this season and the follow on affect it has to so many other Non Ag industries and business. This Indo situation is the last straw for me, my trust in their bureaucracy and their side of the export industry is gone. I have nil faith in the MLA or Live Corp and am not impressed by the previous Federal Ag minister and his staff. Not super impressed with the current one either, tho I would hate his job! So I wont be supplying cattle in the foreseeable future into Indonesia....